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Thread: Economy in Shambles?

  1. #11
    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    This is what happens when you have a bunch of lawyers running the country...the markets showed they have no confidence in the Congress and this administration to do squat about the debt
    All my Exes live in Texas

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  2. #12
    Senior Member Buzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BonMallari View Post
    This is what happens when you have a bunch of lawyers running the country...the markets showed they have no confidence in the Congress and this administration to do squat about the debt
    Now I understand why the interest on a 10 year treasury is surging!

    See link:

    http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=%...5ETNX;range=my


    With the rate on the 10 year, they are actually in essence "paying" the US Government to borrow their money.

    Those darn bond vigilantes.
    Last edited by Buzz; 08-04-2011 at 04:55 PM.
    "For everyone to whom much is given, of him shall much be required." -- Luke 12:48

    Raven - Moneybird's Black Magic Marker***
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    Mick - Moneybird's Jumpin' Jack Flash***
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    Peerless - Moneybird's Sole Survivor
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  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    Now I understand why the interest on a 10 year treasury is surging!

    See link:

    http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=%...5ETNX;range=my


    With the rate on the 10 year, they are actually in essence "paying" the US Government to borrow their money.

    Those darn bond vigilantes.
    the interest rate July 1,2011 was aprox 2.33% by your charts, the lowest in the last 52 weeks. the last tresury nots sold the best I can tell , sold between 2.45-2.60%, a continuation of the drop from the 52 week low til now. Are the rates artificially low? I think so. Since Bernanke became chairman, the FED has kept them low in the hopes of stimulating the economy. How did they do this? The FED bought 600 billion in treasury notes efectively pulling them off the market. Not only that, they lend money to banks at esentiolly 0% interest and the banks buy them at the market rate at the time. Do you might think that if they didn't buy treasury bills that the FED might threaten to raise the rate?? I would not be surprised. At any rate a time will come that the FED can no longer continue to do this because the FED balance sheet will suffer so much that any creditibility they have will be lost. When does that time come? When no one will any longer buy treasury notes and only the FED will. THEN is the time you will have hyperinflation, something this contry has never seen, not even in 1980 when interest rates hit more than 20%.

    I am dumbfounded by your statement that "They pay the Gov. to allow them to loan money to the gov.

    You were asked to justify your statement that the Tea Party is the cause of our economic problems(I really think you can't), maybe you will explain this statement of yours about paying the Govt. to loan it money.
    Last edited by caryalsobrook; 08-04-2011 at 07:10 PM.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Buzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caryalsobrook View Post
    I am dumbfounded by your statement that "They pay the Gov. to allow them to loan money to the gov.
    I will only address this right now because it is 10:15 PM in South Dakota and I need to get out of my office and home to eat supper and go to bed...

    When I said:

    "With the rate on the 10 year, they are actually in essence "paying" the US Government to borrow their money."

    What I meant by this is, if there are expectations for high inflation, and investors believe that this expectation will come to fruition, then they expect to take a loss due to inflation. If they are willingly taking a loss, then in essence they are willing to pay the government for the privilege of holding on to their money for 10 years. The government is in this case borrowing money at a negative rate compared to inflation because what they return to the investor after 10 years is worth less than the investor lent to the government in the first place.

    I don't know why anyone would do that unless they:

    A. Believed that government bonds where the only safe place for them to stash their money besides their mattress where they'll take a bigger loss to inflation.
    B. They don't believe that high inflation rates are coming.
    Last edited by Buzz; 08-04-2011 at 10:30 PM.
    "For everyone to whom much is given, of him shall much be required." -- Luke 12:48

    Raven - Moneybird's Black Magic Marker***
    (Esprit's Power Play x Trumarc's Lean Cuisine)
    Mick - Moneybird's Jumpin' Jack Flash***
    (Clubmead's Road Warrior x Oakdale Whitewater Devil Dog)
    Peerless - Moneybird's Sole Survivor
    (Two River's Lucky Willie x Moneybird's Black Magic Marker)

  5. #15
    Senior Member Franco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post

    I have a very simple view of a billion. I divide a billion by 300 million people. This tells me that every billion spent corresponds to $3.33 for every man, woman, and child in the USA. So, when they talk in billions, a little quick math gives me perspective.
    He is another perspective;

    Using your same numbers, with the bump in the debt ceiling going to over 15 TRILLION, that comes out to $49,950 per person based on 300million people. Since 51% of those people don't pay any taxes, that's a burden of over $100,000.00 per tax payer!
    It's time we abandon our party affiliations and rather than being good Dems or good Repubs we all become good Americans. MJH345

  6. #16
    Senior Member troy schwab's Avatar
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    Its official...... Buzz has clearly lost it, and lives in some paradise unknown........
    SHR Presque Isle Jaeger Schwab JH (driving the bus)

  7. #17
    Senior Member Buzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by troy schwab View Post
    Its official...... Buzz has clearly lost it, and lives in some paradise unknown........
    And here I thought that I was just having an interesting exchange with Cary. At least he challenges my views and explains why he disagrees with me...
    "For everyone to whom much is given, of him shall much be required." -- Luke 12:48

    Raven - Moneybird's Black Magic Marker***
    (Esprit's Power Play x Trumarc's Lean Cuisine)
    Mick - Moneybird's Jumpin' Jack Flash***
    (Clubmead's Road Warrior x Oakdale Whitewater Devil Dog)
    Peerless - Moneybird's Sole Survivor
    (Two River's Lucky Willie x Moneybird's Black Magic Marker)

  8. #18
    Senior Member troy schwab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    And here I thought that I was just having an interesting exchange with Cary. At least he challenges my views and explains why he disagrees with me...

    Well, lets see......

    Gas is still 3.70 a gallon......
    Check grocery prices lately??????
    National Fuel just raised our natural gas rates 10%.....
    Unemployment still above 9%...........
    Dow tanking............
    Electricity rates on rise.......
    Unstable financials across the globe......

    Yep, everythings great in my neck of the woods.......... I need darker rose colored glasses....... WTF.......
    SHR Presque Isle Jaeger Schwab JH (driving the bus)

  9. #19
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by troy schwab View Post
    Well, lets see......

    Gas is still 3.70 a gallon......
    Check grocery prices lately??????
    National Fuel just raised our natural gas rates 10%.....
    Unemployment still above 9%...........
    Dow tanking............
    Electricity rates on rise.......
    Unstable financials across the globe......

    Yep, everythings great in my neck of the woods.......... I need darker rose colored glasses....... WTF.......
    Troy,
    Those are just the things the little people talk about, the intellectual elitists converse on a much higher plane, beyond our comprehension.



    Just sayin'.......

    RK
    Stan b & Elvis

  10. #20
    Senior Member Buzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by troy schwab View Post
    Well, lets see......

    Gas is still 3.70 a gallon......
    Check grocery prices lately??????
    National Fuel just raised our natural gas rates 10%.....
    Unemployment still above 9%...........
    Dow tanking............
    Electricity rates on rise.......
    Unstable financials across the globe......

    Yep, everythings great in my neck of the woods.......... I need darker rose colored glasses....... WTF.......
    Oh, I guess the puts you in the "inflationista's" camp.
    "For everyone to whom much is given, of him shall much be required." -- Luke 12:48

    Raven - Moneybird's Black Magic Marker***
    (Esprit's Power Play x Trumarc's Lean Cuisine)
    Mick - Moneybird's Jumpin' Jack Flash***
    (Clubmead's Road Warrior x Oakdale Whitewater Devil Dog)
    Peerless - Moneybird's Sole Survivor
    (Two River's Lucky Willie x Moneybird's Black Magic Marker)

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