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Training a retreiver puppy by Hillmann ?

33K views 146 replies 50 participants last post by  mattm337 
#1 ·
for those of you who are familiar, how far does the video go in the development of the pup. It is quite pricey and also wanted to know if it is worth the $$$
 
#2 ·
Hopefully someone can post the contents or something to let you know how far it goes.

I'll say this about the $$$...

Buying a quality product and getting the right start for your pup at $129 is so much cheaper than fixing problems that develop from trying to save money with inferior or less complete products.

A quality training program is an investment in your puppy.

Plus, you can likely sell the think used in a few months for $90-100. So net cost will be $30-40. Think about it.
 
#3 ·
It stops at about the point in the dogs training where in a Carr based program flowchart you would be doing the back pile work.......I loved how he got the pup there and I can't wait for the follow up to that DVD.

Yes, it is quite pricey, but the value is in its ability to reach this point and stiil have "ALL" the dog there that you began with............

john
 
#8 ·
I am about 2 weeks into it with my pup who will be 4 months next week! She has been doing fantastic and I really like the program! If the pup does not pick up on a days lesson just repeat it and work at your own pace as it is not a race! I can throw a mark and my pup won't move till released! No pressure at all just fun learning for the dog! Worth the money and can resell as mentioned!!! Really looking forward to getting into basics with this pup as he will be more than ready!

Chris
 
#12 ·
I thought it was a great DVD to use some of the begining techniques on your pup. Much different approach. Because it was much different it was hard for me to apply and fit in my humble program, but I did manage to use some techniques on my youngest, Chief. I guess I had a set way of training my pups already. Most of what I learned came from Lori Jolly's book Motivational Training for the Field. Hillman's key goal is to Build desire into the pup to retrieve. It is for pups. I still think you need to move on to Lardy's, Voigt's or Stawski's DVD's and Lori's book for more training techniques and concepts.These are my 4 main DVDs I continuously refer to!! Hillman's is well worth viewing however. I confess I rented it through BowWow as I have already over bought this year on DVDs but will purchase it yet to add to my library.
 
#14 ·
My impression is that it is much more focused on teaching a pup to sit and earn the retrieve than other approaches. I have not watched the entire DVD as I did not have a pup. Every time I have started watching it, I end up waking up around an hour later. ;-)
 
#16 ·
I asked the question earlier, but appologize that I didn't quite understand the answer. What all does the video teach. I will find out soon, but was wondering what will the dog be capable of at the completion. What sort of commands does he introduce? What obedience is tought?
 
#17 ·
So first thing Hillman says is there are 3 things you want your pup to do: 1. chase something, 2.walk on a line and he does not mean heeling perfectly 3. teach him to sit. As I said he wants to pup to develop desire. Hillman stresses patience, kindness and understanding. There is plenty of obedience in each session. Usually he did these sessions with the pup in the morning when the pup was ready to go and only once a day. He says it is important the pup learns to become a family member rest of the day. The sessions are not stressful to the dog. Stresses you should be persistent with the command "sit". There were 28 days of training as I remember. The pup is taught sit, and while the pup is sitting and as the pup progresses you start to walk around the pup (maintaining sit) and walk further away from the pup and he becomes more steady. I practiced this with my pup and it works well, but you have to be persistent and consistent. Alot of praise goes with each session. He introduces pup to water, water marks, heeling both sides, practice sit with a bumper, introduced the pup to a clipped wing, and teaches you his term traffic cop where he keeps the pup from retrieving then gives the okay to retrieve, starts on Day 10 "hold" , does baby doubles, Day 21 Force Fetch with E collar on low (Ecollar has been on well before this), uses a bird boy to throw and shoot. I used the traffic cop but learned this from Voigt's DVD where he teaches stand alones while you go out and throw. Hillman comes back into his dog, praises him for a good job and then go back out (trafic cop) and sends him. Whole idea to teach steadiness. Works well!
Excellent DVD and I am not going to tell you much more, but it is worthwhile viewing. And this is my translation of what I viewed. Like I said I am going to get the DVD to add to my library. Praise is a big part of the teaching! Good luck
 
#18 ·
Mary Lynn!

That was an excellent synopsis!!!

DVD is worth every penny.

I think it teaches "a way of life" ,,and the dog doesnt even know its learning.
Its an excellent DVD
What I liked is it is actual 28 days of training. There are no staged set-ups, remakes or edits. Its what happened THAT DAY.

There is also no boring lecture time. Its all watchin a puppy progress(very well i might add) in a 28 day time period.


Gooser
 
#20 ·
What constitutes a started dog varies greatly depending on who you ask. Try searching for other threads.

Some folks call a started dog one that can heel to the line on lead, is lead steady (you hold collar or lead), do simple single retrieves on land and water, will deliver to the area of the line. These are the basic requirements for an HRC Started Title. AKC Junior Hunter requirements are similar except require delivery to hand and now require heeling to line off lead. So there are some folks that would call this a started dog.

Others, including myself, would think more in terms of a dog that has been through basics and is doing some basic handling.
 
#21 · (Edited)
In my opinion,,,,

I think a puppy at the end of that Video is a puppy that is ready( Very well prepared) for structured FORMAL training.
In other words,, a puppy that an owner that may be sending a puppy to a Pro would be able to hold their head high and say they had worked some with the PUP.
Gooser
 
#22 · (Edited)
Sorry to be so ignorant, but I am not sure what you mean by formal training. I have read waterdog and a watched a couple of dvd's but they seem to general and basically say get the dog to do this and that, but not really a step by step process so I am hoping that Hillman's video will be better. I am not quite familiar with the terminology. What constitutes informal training. I know it sounds like a stupid question, but I hear those terms bantered around, but not quite sure what they mean.
 
#26 ·
#24 · (Edited)
I guess I may be asking too generalized question. I have seen entire training programs for the price of the Hillman video. Seems like a pretty high price to pay to just get a dog ready to send to the trainer. Since I have decided to train myself and with the help of some other experienced individuals it's a high price for a video that teaches a dog to sit. What makes the video so special? And what is formal training? I assume that many have done this without a trainer so what do you suggest after the hillman video other than just sending the dog to a trainer.
 
#25 ·
To answer your question "What makes the video so special?", especially if you are going to train the dog yourself, is that Bill's method creates a new understanding in the dog's mind of the 'sit' command.

Using Bill's method of teaching the 'sit' command properly to your pup from day 1 will eliminate the need for you to visit the RTF forum and search for this word.....CREEPING!

That one fact is worth its weight in gold!
 
#27 ·
#28 ·
Thanks Tammy!
 
#31 ·
It is a little hard to know if a pup is going to be a high roller at 3 months, but it will certainly teach a pup destined to be a high roller how to properly 'sit' without taking any of their desire away.

Wish I had know about this technique for my Ford pup sired by another FC years ago.......he was destined to be a high roller! He was never properly balanced as a pup and 'conditioned' to the sit command.

I take full credit for it.......looking back now I know it was my own fault, as I was afraid of ruining his wonderful desire. If you look at traditional methods of puppy training.......just think about it a bit, we take them out of their crates and teach them to 'GO' and not 'SIT'.

As soon as I joined my training group in the mornings, I immediately took him out of his box and had friends in my training group throw him ducks. GO GO GO

He never learned to 'sit' and by the time he was 6 months old, he was a monster that was unmanageable. I knew I had a problem and went to many pros for help, but by then it was too late. They were never able to properly 'condition' him to the 'sit' command from that point forward. Unfortunately a dog with enormous potential was unable to live up to it because he never properly learned to 'sit'.

When Bill released his puppy DVD, I got one and watched it immediately realizing that this was what Rip had needed as a pup. I immediately got Rip out and started ALL OVER FROM DAY 1 of Bill's puppy video.

Rip was 4 then and I was able to get enough control of him at the line to run All Age stakes. I have used this technique on every one of my pups since. It will teach them to SIT and not CREEP.

This is why I highly recommend it for anyone who has a retriever pup regardless of whether you just want a hunting dog, hunt test dog or field trial dog. And regardless of whether you will be sending them to a pro or not......I could go on, but in my painful experience it is the only way to start a retriever pup.

Bill's technique is quite unique but you must also pay very close attention to his subtle tips along the way. This is something I missed but have learned by talking to him about the technique.

What is so wonderful about it is that you can taylor the training technique to any type of dog. Soft dogs and high dogs are trained very differently, so pay close attention to Bill when he talks about 'BALANCE'. This is where the art of dog training comes in, and you must notice whether the pup needs pushed in the area of desire or control. When you notice the pup getting discouraged, you then go back to Bill's excitement phase of chasing. With a high pup who is very excited to go, you will use more 'sitting' and teaching them patience. BALANCE BALANCE BALANCE

Good luck in training your retrievers in 2012.....
 
#33 ·
When I first started looking at the Hillmann DVDs, I too wondered why the high price!! But, I took the leap and bought the puppy video first, and boy am I glad I did!! He starts pups very differently than any I have seen before, and it has been worth every dime to me. I have started 2 pups with his methods and have been so happy with the RESULTS....money well spent in my opinion.
 
#35 ·
One of the largest values I was able to take away from the video was purely what he doesn't talk about. The use of non verbal cues and body language. Reading your dog is also brought up every time a discussion starts and without the subtle hints and visual referencences in this video it would have taken me much longer to understand what that means.
 
#36 ·
I will say this.

You hear all the times Pros say they get a puppy in for training,, and the owner said they didnt do anything with the pup because they didnt want to screw it up.

I think Hillmans DVD gives you a good road to follow to prepair a pup for further traing.

Their are many OPINIONS as to where a dog should be in training BEFORE it starts running Hunt tests!!

Some say its a progression and the steps the various venues use will gradually move the dog along.

Many experienced people dont think ANY dog should be running any tests untill it has been FF'd and is doing a good job with basic handeling. (simple cold blinds both land and water) I happen to agrre with this opinion now after 3dogs.

IMHO the Hillman video Gives a very VISUAL approach to PREPARE a puppy to a lifestyle of learning and training. Its PUPPY TRAINING......
I dont believe the DVD that is the topic of the thread was in anyway meant to be taken as a Program.... ITS a very inteligent stuctured way to introduce a puppy to mulitude of situations, at the same time have the pup learn also.

Dont get so caught up in the cost of information!
I believe there was a link given where you can rent the DVD if ya want.. Rent IT!!! and see what YOU think!!!
I think its pretty amazing how that Puppy,, that is a a nice dog,,but pretty typical in the way it behaves, progresses in 28 DAYS!!!!

I think the Hillman dvd will prepare a pup that can proceede smoothly with Grahm, Lardy ect!! and I bet these Pros would fall all over themselves with excitement,, if owners would take the time to prepare a PUPPY like this BEFORE it starts a Formal training program.

JMHDAO.:razz:
 
#39 ·
I think the Hillman dvd will prepare a pup that can proceede smoothly with Grahm, Lardy ect!! and I bet these Pros would fall all over themselves with excitement,, if owners would take the time to prepare a PUPPY like this BEFORE it starts a Formal training program.

JMHDAO.:razz:
Why change the training protocol. don't you think that further training could continue in the same vein?

John
 
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