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Searched and took her to the Vet... heat cycle

16K views 139 replies 30 participants last post by  TJ Shanahan 
#1 ·
Okay my BLF is supposed to be going in heat. which the vet said she is starting to after doing a vaginal swab and looking at the cells on a slide, I still didn't really get the question answered tho by the vet. and I did try the search function there were just ALOT of threads about heat cycles

Started to see blood drops last friday on the floor only a drop a day till today there were multiple, do I start counting the days she is in heat last friday at the first blood drop or do I start counting today.

And... How much is a progesterone test for you all, I was planning on doing 2 to 3 but they wanted 130 a piece for them and am not so sure now and was thinking of just dropping her off at the studs place for around a week... What would you do? thanks
 
#106 ·
Anne I think you are right, on nanomoles and Canada.
I only brought it up because it looks like the vet is doing an in house test.....could be a different measure....
 
#107 ·
Both the first breedings w/ my girl who whelped early were done on the early side at 9.5ng (the litter born 4 days early) and 7.5ng (the litter 3-4 days early). Semen was great each time. We also did a 2nd AI 2 days after the first. 9 puppies in each litter.
Anne, I looked at your blog and I get 61 days from ovulation. Ovulation the 13th of Oct and birth on the 13th of Dec. Did you miss counting the last 2 days in October?
 
#112 ·
You did the AI on the 14th. Did you do the AI before you drew the progesterone? Were the pups muzzles lacking hair? Because that's how you know they are that early. I've done enough that I can say that.
October 14, 2011: First AI at 7.6 ng progesterone. This was a little on the early side, but the weekend messed up things!


According to MY notes (which my vet agreed with), they were due 9 wks (63 days) from early Fri, Oct 14. According to my Dayrunner, 9 wks was Fri. Dec 16. Yea or Nay? They were born in the wee hours of Tues which was 3 days early last I knew. If you want to debate this further, go for it girls.
 
#117 · (Edited)
According to MY notes (which my vet agreed with), they were due 9 wks (63 days) from early Fri, Oct 14. According to my Dayrunner, 9 wks was Fri. Dec 16. Yea or Nay? They were born in the wee hours of Tues which was 3 days early last I knew. If you want to debate this further, go for it girls.
You and your vet are making the incorrect assumption that ALL dogs rise at "~5" everyday after ovulation. That isn't true. I had one that rose about 1 1/2 the day after, progesterones done 2 days in a row because we couldn't get her bred when I got to the stud and I had the progesterone done the next morning and I also had one that probably rose about 12 to 15 or more points since she got up to 46 from 3.2 in 3 days. Even my repro vet admitted that was extreme.

This is for those that are following this thread to learn: Progesterones are not that rigid a calculation, and while there are averages,
there are many dogs that do not fit a rigid scheme in length of cycles or progesterone progression before and after ovulation. What is happening, is through progesterones, we are able to breed some of these bitches that probably couldn't be bred before based on counting days, so we have to deal with their progeny that have unusual cycles.
 
#111 ·
Justin Did you get a breeding done? When are you expecting?
 
#113 ·
the natural way to tell, get a male if she will move her tail to the side and stand for
him without a fight. Shes ready.....get her over to your stud for some fun. I go by 12=16 days after first sign of spotting. male dogs dont usually charge, free test. you dont let your test dog mount unless he's da man
 
#115 ·
the natural way to tell, get a male if she will move her tail to the side and stand for
him without a fight. Shes ready.....get her over to your stud for some fun. I go by 12=16 days after first sign of spotting. male dogs dont usually charge, free test. you dont let your test dog mount unless he's da man
Good luck with that when the semen is being shipped across the country and this is your girls last breeding...:rolleyes:
But yes that is one of the indicaters;-)
 
#116 ·
Fascinating thread. As one who has only done a couple breedings the old fashioned way, I have wondered a bunch about the mechanics of AI breedings. This thread has been very enlightening to me. I thank all the contributors to this discussion, I have learned a LOT!
 
#118 ·
Ok she has been lagging but her levels are starting to finally rise she was a 2.57 on monday and I am getting another sample taken today, it is day 19 and all the vets kept telling me that it is probably a non ovulating cycle- I wasn't sure but we are now on track... unless she stalls we are breeding to Landover's right on Target - Aero this week or weekend - thank goodness for spring break she is causing me grey hairs and I am only 27 - I WANT A PUPPY! HA and fingers crossed I think I might beable to get one now :)
 
#119 ·
PERFECT CASE IN POINT!!! NON regular bitch

Hang in there sounds like you may be at the LH surge....Keep us posted OK?
 
#120 ·
Will do- and thanks for all your help and Nancy's
 
#123 ·
Interestingly enough, the natural ethylene climacteric curve in most apple varieties is VERY similar to the AVERAGE progesterone curve of my dogs!
I knew it-you are comparing dogs to apples.:rolleyes:
 
#124 ·
Okay monday maggie was 2.56 and I got the test back from yesterday blood draw this morning and she was 6.7 the vet said she would be around 10 to 12 today so I brought her up to the stud today this evening she would stand for a bit then move around and wave her tail so he couldn't stay in... is she still not ready?
 
#126 ·
Okay, Maggie is a figgiter every time he would start to insert she would move her tail or move her rear end, then we held her in place and tried to help guide him Maggie still managed to move around enough to not let it happen. On Friday she was a 20.6 we found out on saturday we tried really hard a couple of times on saturday - still no dice it was like she would move more when we came close. So I called vets all around up here and the vets that would answer the phone or return a call did not want to do a side by side today so I researched online watched videos on line on how to do a side by side and went to the local farm and fleet store got a clear plastic tube rubber gloves a 60 cc serenge and some ky jelly. I collected from him and then sucked it up in the serenge and then slowly inserted the tube - I looked at the female dog anatomy - I guided it with my finger past the bladder then slowly got it about 8 inches in and then hooked up the tube to serenge and then sqeezed it in a little came out but I think the majority stayed in. since she ovulated on wednesday it might have been a lost cause but I can say I gave an honest effort. thanks for everybodys help
 
#130 ·
.............WOW.....................good luck with that, if the time was right you just may get a litter. I know when I was taught to AI the woman 15 yrs ago used aquarium tubing.Now I use a rod with a bullet tip , it is great because it is so smooth . I just hope you were clean enough...
They say you can learn anything from You Tube...What stud dog did you use?

Okay, Maggie is a figgiter every time he would start to insert she would move her tail or move her rear end, then we held her in place and tried to help guide him Maggie still managed to move around enough to not let it happen. On Friday she was a 20.6 we found out on saturday we tried really hard a couple of times on saturday - still no dice it was like she would move more when we came close. So I called vets all around up here and the vets that would answer the phone or return a call did not want to do a side by side today so I researched online watched videos on line on how to do a side by side and went to the local farm and fleet store got a clear plastic tube rubber gloves a 60 cc serenge and some ky jelly. I collected from him and then sucked it up in the serenge and then slowly inserted the tube - I looked at the female dog anatomy - I guided it with my finger past the bladder then slowly got it about 8 inches in and then hooked up the tube to serenge and then sqeezed it in a little came out but I think the majority stayed in. since she ovulated on wednesday it might have been a lost cause but I can say I gave an honest effort. thanks for everybodys help
 
#127 ·
This is quite a story -- or should I say nightmare? I hope your Turkey Baster efforts worked. Be sure to let us know if she conceived or did not conceive.

Helen
 
#135 ·
thanks I wasn't sure
 
#136 ·
Here is another question for the experienced ones, if a bitch is pregnant do males generally still try to hump them - I am working with a younger male and every time i let him out with maggie he tries to hump her after he has sniffed her pee spot and crotch - or is he just being a really horny 11 month old?
 
#137 ·
Hey Justin , what's the verdict?
 
#138 ·
I knew when I started reading this 2 hours ago that it was a few years old. And, I'm not trying to rekindle any flames from any one fired up back then, But I truly learned from this reading and think others will too if it's brought back to Life. So, Back to the top it goes.
 
#139 ·
Just to settle the original post the breeding did not take, that said I did get Maggie bred this last year and she had a litter of 9 pups 7 lived, the stud dog owner said in order to get her to stand still he had to tire her out on fun retrieves and then put her in with the stud.

I now know so much more about breeding, from this thread and experiences. last spring she had a late ovulation and I didnt know enough about breeding plus the stud dog owner never had a problem with his stud tying up so it was an experience for us both, I now got a new puppy out of my Maggie and she is a blast to say the least following the Hillman program she is already sitting on command and walking on a leash, I hope to get a QAA at least out of her but time will tell thanks for all the good advise
 
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