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Thread: Searched and took her to the Vet... heat cycle

  1. #121
    Senior Member ErinsEdge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustinS View Post
    Will do- and thanks for all your help and Nancy's
    Your welome. You were wise to pm me and not give up.
    Nancy P



    "We give dogs time we can spare, space we can spare and love we can spare. And in return, dogs give us their all. It's the best deal man has ever made." M.Facklam

  2. #122
    Senior Member windycanyon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ErinsEdge View Post
    You and your vet are making the incorrect assumption that ALL dogs rise at "~5" everyday after ovulation.
    I doubt that I ever said "ALL" because I know better than to speak in those terms. My own girls appear to avg more like 4-5ng / day once they hit 5ng and they've been known to stall at ~3.5 ng for a day or so (think I may have said this at some point here since both Sonya and her mother tend to stall). That's the part of the info that you can't see--- the graphs I have generated of all of the progesterone curves.

    My real world work in the apple industry here in WA revolves around ethylene, the naturally occuring hormone responsible for fruit ripening in climacteric type fruits (apples, some pears, peaches, tomatoes, etc). Interestingly enough, the natural ethylene climacteric curve in most apple varieties is VERY similar to the AVERAGE progesterone curve of my dogs! Yes, there are some modifiers in both apples and dogs (stress in both come to mind), but that's biology for you, and that's why we have to continue to follow thru on the testing if you want the most accurate results.

    So, there you have it, I'm a nerd. My vet and I have been known to place bets on progesterone draws. The stud owner on the other end this last time is also a repro vet btw and she also agreed, so fwiw...

    And Nancy, I'd not expect to see hairless puppies born after day 58 or so. Just my recollection from a repro/ neonatal seminar I attended so I could be wrong there. I most likely used the term "early" in my case since mine were fully developed (but smaller than I'd like and the tiniest one died in this litter-- lost 2 in her previous litter which by my projections were born on day 59). Hope that helps.

  3. #123
    Senior Member ErinsEdge's Avatar
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    Interestingly enough, the natural ethylene climacteric curve in most apple varieties is VERY similar to the AVERAGE progesterone curve of my dogs!
    I knew it-you are comparing dogs to apples.
    Nancy P



    "We give dogs time we can spare, space we can spare and love we can spare. And in return, dogs give us their all. It's the best deal man has ever made." M.Facklam

  4. #124
    Senior Member JustinS's Avatar
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    Okay monday maggie was 2.56 and I got the test back from yesterday blood draw this morning and she was 6.7 the vet said she would be around 10 to 12 today so I brought her up to the stud today this evening she would stand for a bit then move around and wave her tail so he couldn't stay in... is she still not ready?
    Justin E Schneider

    Xtreme's 30 Rounds N' 1 Full Maggie SH
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    "Money will buy you a pretty good dog, but it won't buy the wag of his tail." -- Josh Billings

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  5. #125
    Senior Member windycanyon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustinS View Post
    Okay monday maggie was 2.56 and I got the test back from yesterday blood draw this morning and she was 6.7 the vet said she would be around 10 to 12 today so I brought her up to the stud today this evening she would stand for a bit then move around and wave her tail so he couldn't stay in... is she still not ready?
    Yea, finally some progress! Did your vet check for a stricture? One of mine had one that prevented a tie, but she still had 12 puppies.

  6. #126
    Senior Member JustinS's Avatar
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    Okay, Maggie is a figgiter every time he would start to insert she would move her tail or move her rear end, then we held her in place and tried to help guide him Maggie still managed to move around enough to not let it happen. On Friday she was a 20.6 we found out on saturday we tried really hard a couple of times on saturday - still no dice it was like she would move more when we came close. So I called vets all around up here and the vets that would answer the phone or return a call did not want to do a side by side today so I researched online watched videos on line on how to do a side by side and went to the local farm and fleet store got a clear plastic tube rubber gloves a 60 cc serenge and some ky jelly. I collected from him and then sucked it up in the serenge and then slowly inserted the tube - I looked at the female dog anatomy - I guided it with my finger past the bladder then slowly got it about 8 inches in and then hooked up the tube to serenge and then sqeezed it in a little came out but I think the majority stayed in. since she ovulated on wednesday it might have been a lost cause but I can say I gave an honest effort. thanks for everybodys help
    Justin E Schneider

    Xtreme's 30 Rounds N' 1 Full Maggie SH
    Foundation's One Up the Sleeve


    "Money will buy you a pretty good dog, but it won't buy the wag of his tail." -- Josh Billings

    Some peoples stiffest competition is themselves.--MooseGooser

  7. #127
    Senior Member helencalif's Avatar
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    This is quite a story -- or should I say nightmare? I hope your Turkey Baster efforts worked. Be sure to let us know if she conceived or did not conceive.

    Helen

  8. #128
    Senior Member 1st retriever's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by windycanyon View Post

    And Nancy, I'd not expect to see hairless puppies born after day 58 or so.
    Friend has had a couple litters of Shiba Inu puppies born on day 58 and they were fine. Not that anyone cares.
    Steph

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  9. #129
    Senior Member ErinsEdge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1st retriever View Post
    Friend has had a couple litters of Shiba Inu puppies born on day 58 and they were fine. Not that anyone cares.
    In my actual experience, early pups have less hair on their faces, but it is rare for a dog to be 4 days early, and it all depends on how you count, which obviously is not the same from person to person.
    Nancy P



    "We give dogs time we can spare, space we can spare and love we can spare. And in return, dogs give us their all. It's the best deal man has ever made." M.Facklam

  10. #130
    Senior Member Bridget Bodine's Avatar
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    .............WOW.....................good luck with that, if the time was right you just may get a litter. I know when I was taught to AI the woman 15 yrs ago used aquarium tubing.Now I use a rod with a bullet tip , it is great because it is so smooth . I just hope you were clean enough...
    They say you can learn anything from You Tube...What stud dog did you use?

    Quote Originally Posted by JustinS View Post
    Okay, Maggie is a figgiter every time he would start to insert she would move her tail or move her rear end, then we held her in place and tried to help guide him Maggie still managed to move around enough to not let it happen. On Friday she was a 20.6 we found out on saturday we tried really hard a couple of times on saturday - still no dice it was like she would move more when we came close. So I called vets all around up here and the vets that would answer the phone or return a call did not want to do a side by side today so I researched online watched videos on line on how to do a side by side and went to the local farm and fleet store got a clear plastic tube rubber gloves a 60 cc serenge and some ky jelly. I collected from him and then sucked it up in the serenge and then slowly inserted the tube - I looked at the female dog anatomy - I guided it with my finger past the bladder then slowly got it about 8 inches in and then hooked up the tube to serenge and then sqeezed it in a little came out but I think the majority stayed in. since she ovulated on wednesday it might have been a lost cause but I can say I gave an honest effort. thanks for everybodys help
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