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Thread: Penn State

  1. #11
    Senior Member M&K's Retrievers's Avatar
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    Yeah, that's the ticket. Kill everyone like they did with SMU to make sure they get all the guilty even those that haven't been born yet. Grow up! Paterno's legacy is ruined as are the lives of the others involved with the cover up and that is as it should be. Even that young coach that only reported the event to Joe is screwed for life even if it's only in his mind. I have never been a Paterno fan. No one can be as squeaky clean as he appeared and he turned out to be the lowest of the low. Isn't that enough for you or should we burn down the school as well?

    That's my opinion but I could be wrong.
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  2. #12
    Senior Member roseberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    That's my opinion but I could be wrong.

    mike,
    i don't think the loss of the football program at smu has affected the institutions long term academic reputation. being able to attend a football game on a college campus is something many students at smaller institutions never have the opportunity to enjoy. these students are educated none the less.

    as trainers, when we throw a mark and we get creeping, noise, breaking, head swinging etc. we know the bird is more important to our dog than compliance and obedience to our standards. most will use an aversive measure and deny the bird.

    at many major college football programs like penn state, success on the field has become more important to the institution, coaches and fans than the most basic standards of behavior in our society. all i'm saying is "deny the bird". not kill the damn dog!

    gerry,
    the way it looks today, coach paterno didn't remain silent. he spoke up to ensure that others remained silent. very different.


    by the way, i was a long time paterno admirer. he appeared class in his 14-7 loss to alabama for the national championship in the 78 sugar bowl. his 17-14 spanking of miami and vinny testaverde in the 86 orange bowl was a masterpiece in defensive preparedness and in my view the best coached defensive game of any national championship matchup ever. but as we all know, power corrupts, absolute power.............
    john mccallie

  3. #13
    Senior Member M&K's Retrievers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by roseberry View Post
    mike,
    i don't think the loss of the football program at smu has affected the institutions long term academic reputation. being able to attend a football game on a college campus is something many students at smaller institutions never have the opportunity to enjoy. these students are educated none the less.

    as trainers, when we throw a mark and we get creeping, noise, breaking, head swinging etc. we know the bird is more important to our dog than compliance and obedience to our standards. most will use an aversive measure and deny the bird.

    at many major college football programs like penn state, success on the field has become more important to the institution, coaches and fans than the most basic standards of behavior in our society. all i'm saying is "deny the bird". not kill the damn dog!

    gerry,
    the way it looks today, coach paterno didn't remain silent. he spoke up to ensure that others remained silent. very different.


    by the way, i was a long time paterno admirer. he appeared class in his 14-7 loss to alabama for the national championship in the 78 sugar bowl. his 17-14 spanking of miami and vinny testaverde in the 86 orange bowl was a masterpiece in defensive preparedness and in my view the best coached defensive game of any national championship matchup ever. but as we all know, power corrupts, absolute power.............
    If your dog breaks, don't deny my dog his bird.
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  4. #14
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    gerry,
    the way it looks today, coach paterno didn't remain silent. he spoke up to ensure that others remained silent. very different.
    Yes, I see your point ... a terribly sad legacy to leave behind for those who thought so highly of the man & never suspected what was going on behind the scenes.
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    Sports build character.....Sports build character.........Sports build........????

  6. #16
    Senior Member roseberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    If your dog breaks, don't deny my dog his bird.
    good point mike! though i think in this instance the all age dogs looking through the louvers of their hole on the truck could actually learn something from the corrections issued to the dog currently on the matt. then again, maybe not?
    john mccallie

  7. #17
    Senior Member LokiMeister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    If your dog breaks, don't deny my dog his bird.
    By eliminating Penn States football program you aren't denying anybody anything that they are at the university for, an education. Players will find other places to play and you shouldn't pick a university for it's football if you are only in academia. The problem is so rooted in that program that numerous people chose to break the law. One has to ask, why wasn't Sandusky a coach anymore? Many coaches coach into their 60's and 70's. Why didn't Sandusky? You know darn well that a pedophile just doesn't start doing this in his 40's. I'll bet Sandusky did something earlier than 1998 that caused the program to get rid of a very good coach.

    Look at Enron. The heads of that company were corrupt, the subordinates lost their jobs, ie. they moved on. That is the way it is. Why should Penn State be any different?
    Last edited by LokiMeister; 07-13-2012 at 08:53 AM.
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  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by LokiMeister View Post
    By eliminating Penn States football program you aren't denying anybody anything that they are at the university for, an education. Players will find other places to play and you shouldn't pick a university for it's football if you are only in academia. The problem is so rooted in that program that numerous people chose to break the law. One has to ask, why wasn't Sandusky a coach anymore? Many coaches coach into their 60's and 70's. Why didn't Sandusky? You know darn well that a pedophile just doesn't start doing this in his 40's. I'll bet Sandusky did something earlier than 1998 that caused the program to get rid of a very good coach.

    Look at Enron. The heads of that company were corrupt, the subordinates lost their jobs, ie. they moved on. That is the way it is. Why should Penn State be any different?
    What exactly do you hope to accomplish by eliminating Penn States football program? What about the effect that would have on other sports at Penn State that are funded by the football program?

    Don't get me wrong. I'm not a Penn State fan and have never cared for Paterno and his "clean" program. It's a shame he doesn't have to answer for this here but I suspect he is elsewhere.

    What you suggest punishes far too many. SMU hasn't recovered for the "death penalty" and it's been 25 years.
    Last edited by M&K's Retrievers; 07-13-2012 at 09:15 AM.
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  9. #19
    Senior Member LokiMeister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    What exactly do you hope to accomplish by eliminating Penn States football program? What about the effect that would have on other sports at Penn State that are funded by the football program?

    Don't get me wrong. I'm not a Penn State fan and have never cared for Paterno and his "clean" program. It's a shame he doesn't have to answer for this here but I suspect he is elsewhere.

    What you suggest punishes far too many. SMU hasn't recovered for the "death penalty" and it's been 25 years.
    Very simply, it eliminates, hopefully, the power that the football program has. Remember, the NCAA isn't punishing anybody in reality. It is the people that did the crimes that are doing the punishing. It's like a bad employee that is fired. Usually, you don't fire them, they normally fire themselves. You are just making it official. Sports, like government, controls way to much in this society. Time to take some of that control back.

    What do you mean SMU's program hasn't recovered? They play football at SMU. Why do they have to rise up to the level they were at to be recovered? Why can't the current staff elevate the team to it's former prominence? Sounds like bad coaching to me.
    Kevin Entwistle

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  10. #20
    Senior Member M&K's Retrievers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LokiMeister View Post
    Very simply, it eliminates, hopefully, the power that the football program has. Remember, the NCAA isn't punishing anybody in reality. It is the people that did the crimes that are doing the punishing. It's like a bad employee that is fired. Usually, you don't fire them, they normally fire themselves. You are just making it official. Sports, like government, controls way to much in this society. Time to take some of that control back.

    What do you mean SMU's program hasn't recovered? They play football at SMU. Why do they have to rise up to the level they were at to be recovered? Why can't the current staff elevate the team to it's former prominence? Sounds like bad coaching to me.
    The NCAA is not punishing anybody as there are no NCAA violations. The people responsible are being punished in one way or another. There is no need to punish the innocent.Cratering Penn State's football program will do nothing to correct what you see as as problem. You sound as if you have an axe to grind with Penn State or at the very least you would like to do away with football's contributions to the colleges. Good luck with that.

    As for SMU recovering. Hardly. They continue to play in a marginal conference. A quarter of a century later and they can't draw fans, recruits or a decent coaching staff. Television money, alumni contribution, etc. suck. Also, the SMU Death Penalty also contributed to the demise of the Southwest Conference.
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