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Thread: Penn State

  1. #21
    Senior Member LokiMeister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    The NCAA is not punishing anybody as there are no NCAA violations. The people responsible are being punished in one way or another. There is no need to punish the innocent.Cratering Penn State's football program will do nothing to correct what you see as as problem. You sound as if you have an axe to grind with Penn State or at the very least you would like to do away with football's contributions to the colleges. Good luck with that.

    As for SMU recovering. Hardly. They continue to play in a marginal conference. A quarter of a century later and they can't draw fans, recruits or a decent coaching staff. Television money, alumni contribution, etc. suck. Also, the SMU Death Penalty also contributed to the demise of the Southwest Conference.
    Isn't the coverup is related to football which is part of the NCAA? Isn't Penn State University part of the NCAA? Isn't the coverup a direct result of the power the football team has over the rest of the school? PSU went to Paterno's house to fire him and he said no you're not going to fire me. Isn't that too much power? Isn't it corrupt that an EMPLOYEE says to their employer you're not going to fire me? Don't you see anything wrong with this?

    I don't have a problem with the football product or any other athletic product that PSU has fielded. In fact, I appreciate the fact that PSU is starting a hockey program allowing the Big Ten to have a hockey conference. It will give my university, Minnesota a chance to get back at PSU for all the football drubbings over the years. I love college football and other college sports. I appreciate what they bring to the college life. What I don't like is they have entirely too much influence on what is supposed to be EXTRAcurricular, not the basic reason for being. The fault of that can be television money.

    SMU barely contributed to the demise of the Southwest Conference. You have to show me proof of that. Television money is what contributed to the demise of that conference.
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  2. #22
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    Paterno knew what was going down.. the reason he kept it quiet was because he wanted to win more games then Coach Bryant..

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  3. #23
    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LokiMeister View Post
    Isn't the coverup is related to football which is part of the NCAA? Isn't Penn State University part of the NCAA? Isn't the coverup a direct result of the power the football team has over the rest of the school? PSU went to Paterno's house to fire him and he said no you're not going to fire me. Isn't that too much power? Isn't it corrupt that an EMPLOYEE says to their employer you're not going to fire me? Don't you see anything wrong with this?

    I don't have a problem with the football product or any other athletic product that PSU has fielded. In fact, I appreciate the fact that PSU is starting a hockey program allowing the Big Ten to have a hockey conference. It will give my university, Minnesota a chance to get back at PSU for all the football drubbings over the years. I love college football and other college sports. I appreciate what they bring to the college life. What I don't like is they have entirely too much influence on what is supposed to be EXTRAcurricular, not the basic reason for being. The fault of that can be television money.

    SMU barely contributed to the demise of the Southwest Conference. You have to show me proof of that. Television money is what contributed to the demise of that conference.

    You didnt live in Dallas like Mike and I did during that time...SMU went from playing for National Championships and having games at Texas Stadium to nothing..they had Eric Dickerson and Craig James, they stomped my Horns, just flat out beat em...they not only hurt the school , it also hurt their main rival across town in TCU..the death penalty at SMU sent shockwaves thru the SWC..lots of in state kids left to play in the SEC and the west coast..SMU is a VERY affluent school, the neighborhood is one of THE wealthiest in Dallas, its the old Dallas money, but their reputation was destroyed, still is to this day...was probably the straw that broke the SWC's back,because before they came along it was TEXAS and a bunch of also rans..SMU showed other Texas schools that they could recruit in state along with UT and Oklahoma (who was still in the Big 8 at the time)
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    As for SMU recovering. Hardly. They continue to play in a marginal conference. A quarter of a century later and they can't draw fans, recruits or a decent coaching staff. Television money, alumni contribution, etc. suck. Also, the SMU Death Penalty also contributed to the demise of the Southwest Conference.
    Stupid actions warrant consequences - Oral Roberts did the same thing in Basketball, on their own. They are now playing their way back up the competitve ladder .

    Quote Originally Posted by LokiMeister View Post
    In fact, I appreciate the fact that PSU is starting a hockey program allowing the Big Ten to have a hockey conference. It will give my university, Minnesota a chance to get back at PSU for all the football drubbings over the years. I love college football and other college sports. I appreciate what they bring to the college life. What I don't like is they have entirely too much influence on what is supposed to be EXTRAcurricular, not the basic reason for being. The fault of that can be television money.

    SMU barely contributed to the demise of the Southwest Conference. You have to show me proof of that. Television money is what contributed to the demise of that conference.
    I remember when MN had a FB program of merit . Didn't someone on this thread say some higher ups were pushing to kick PSU out of the Big 10.

    In case you missed it Loki, there is an annual award given called the Doak Walker award - guess where he went to school. I'd personally like to see another SWC, gives a regional flavor to the sport.

    But I do agree with you that a university exists to provide education. When was the last time a Heisman winner participated in a meaningful curriculum while in college?

    But after all is said & done, Freeh's report is very harmful to all those who chose to forget about the victims. The 14 Mil that the Paterno's got from PSU is going to look like chicken feed when the kids who were abused have their day in court. The family is engaged in damage control as they have learned from a master how to put your own selfish interests 1st & foremost .
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  5. #25
    Senior Member LokiMeister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BonMallari View Post
    You didnt live in Dallas like Mike and I did during that time...SMU went from playing for National Championships and having games at Texas Stadium to nothing..they had Eric Dickerson and Craig James, they stomped my Horns, just flat out beat em...they not only hurt the school , it also hurt their main rival across town in TCU..the death penalty at SMU sent shockwaves thru the SWC..lots of in state kids left to play in the SEC and the west coast..SMU is a VERY affluent school, the neighborhood is one of THE wealthiest in Dallas, its the old Dallas money, but their reputation was destroyed, still is to this day...was probably the straw that broke the SWC's back,because before they came along it was TEXAS and a bunch of also rans..SMU showed other Texas schools that they could recruit in state along with UT and Oklahoma (who was still in the Big 8 at the time)
    I would argue that they got what was coming to them. They cheated, the people who did the cheating destroyed SMU's reputation. It seems that the people don't want a program that is all powerful.

    TCU beat heavily favored Wisconsin in the 2011 (?) Rose Bowl. They seem to be doing well, what's SMU's problem?
    Last edited by LokiMeister; 07-13-2012 at 01:26 PM.
    Kevin Entwistle

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    "Lars" Chilian with the Rainmaker, born: Feb. 2, 2010


    "That which you manifest is before you" (The Art of Racing in the Rain)

    "Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have ... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases." Thomas Jefferson

  6. #26
    Senior Member M&K's Retrievers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LokiMeister View Post
    I would argue that they got what was coming to them. They cheated, the people who did the cheating destroyed SMU's reputation. It seems that the people don't want a program that is all powerful.

    TCU beat heavily favored Wisconsin in the 2011 (?) Rose Bowl. They seem to be doing well, what's SMU's problem?
    Wondering how you can compare TCU to SMU. SMU got the death penalty not TCU. SMU lost two seasons, lost 55 scholarships, coaching staff reduced to 6, existing team members allowed to transfer to other schools without having to sit out a season to name a few.

    The NCAA has never given the death penalty out since. They know they blew it and that the results of their penalties far exceeded their intent.
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  7. #27
    Senior Member LokiMeister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    Wondering how you can compare TCU to SMU. SMU got the death penalty not TCU. SMU lost two seasons, lost 55 scholarships, coaching staff reduced to 6, existing team members allowed to transfer to other schools without having to sit out a season to name a few.
    BonMallari did originally, see his post #23. I didn't understand how he could either, I just responded to it.
    Kevin Entwistle

    WGD (Worlds Greatest Dog) Cinci Redstocking "Loki", born: Jan. 22, 1999, RIP November 13, 2011
    "Lars" Chilian with the Rainmaker, born: Feb. 2, 2010


    "That which you manifest is before you" (The Art of Racing in the Rain)

    "Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have ... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases." Thomas Jefferson

  8. #28
    Senior Member LokiMeister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    The NCAA has never given the death penalty out since. They know they blew it and that the results of their penalties far exceeded their intent.
    That would be incorrect:

    The death penalty is the popular term for the National Collegiate Athletic Association's power to ban a school from competing in a sport for at least one year. It is the harshest penalty that an NCAA member school can receive.

    It has been implemented only five times:

    The University of Kentucky basketball program for the 1952–53 season.[1]
    The basketball program at the University of Southwestern Louisiana (now the University of Louisiana at Lafayette) for the 1973–74 and 1974–75 seasons.
    The Southern Methodist University football program for the 1987 and 1988 seasons.
    The Division II men's soccer program at Morehouse College for the 2004 and 2005 seasons.
    The Division III men's tennis program at MacMurray College for the 2005–06 and 2006–07 seasons
    Kevin Entwistle

    WGD (Worlds Greatest Dog) Cinci Redstocking "Loki", born: Jan. 22, 1999, RIP November 13, 2011
    "Lars" Chilian with the Rainmaker, born: Feb. 2, 2010


    "That which you manifest is before you" (The Art of Racing in the Rain)

    "Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have ... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases." Thomas Jefferson

  9. #29
    Senior Member M&K's Retrievers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LokiMeister View Post
    That would be incorrect:

    The death penalty is the popular term for the National Collegiate Athletic Association's power to ban a school from competing in a sport for at least one year. It is the harshest penalty that an NCAA member school can receive.

    It has been implemented only five times:

    The University of Kentucky basketball program for the 1952–53 season.[1]
    The basketball program at the University of Southwestern Louisiana (now the University of Louisiana at Lafayette) for the 1973–74 and 1974–75 seasons.
    The Southern Methodist University football program for the 1987 and 1988 seasons.****
    The Division II men's soccer program at Morehouse College for the 2004 and 2005 seasons.
    The Division III men's tennis program at MacMurray College for the 2005–06 and 2006–07 seasons
    **** Plus 55 lost scholarships, reduction in coaching staff to 6 (4 of which could recruit off campus) and allowed their existing team to transfer which most did. No other school has received this harsh punishment.

    I'll let you have the last word cause I'm not a big SMU fan either. Leave Penn State football alone. Had Paterno had knowledge of an assistant who robbed a bank should the team be penalized? Penalize the team for NCAA violations.
    Last edited by M&K's Retrievers; 07-13-2012 at 03:53 PM.
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  10. #30
    Senior Member LokiMeister's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by M&K's Retrievers View Post
    **** Plus 55 lost scholarships, reduction in coaching staff to 6 (4 of which could recruit off campus) and allowed their existing team to transfer which most did.
    Yes, you mentioned that before. Are those restrictions still in place?
    Kevin Entwistle

    WGD (Worlds Greatest Dog) Cinci Redstocking "Loki", born: Jan. 22, 1999, RIP November 13, 2011
    "Lars" Chilian with the Rainmaker, born: Feb. 2, 2010


    "That which you manifest is before you" (The Art of Racing in the Rain)

    "Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have ... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases." Thomas Jefferson

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