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Thread: Question #2

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by menmon View Post
    Let me dumb it down a little bit.....most of our economic woes stem from the attack on the twin towers. Because of them, we have increased government to make the country safe, no increased revenue to pay for the additional safety....we just finish one costly war that we had no additional revenue to pay for....still in a war that we have not increased revenue to pay for.....economic terror. How best to hurt us but in our pocketbook.

    So if you want to know why the mighty dollar does not buy as much, it is because we keep running up our credit card and can only afford the minimum. Don't dare ask anyone to pay for it except the old and aflicted.

    Is that clear enough for you or do I need to dumb it down some more.
    Your attempt at insulting people by talking down to them failed miserably. If you had said this the first time vice hiding it in a makes no sense statement you would have been farther ahead and people would actually think you had valuable input to the conversation.

    Richard

  2. #22
    Senior Member LokiMeister's Avatar
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    Economically, raising taxes on the rich may or may not do anything for the economy. If it hurts the economy, we will be worse off because the increase in the taxes by the rich will be more than offset by the decrease in taxes by the rest of us.

    It is not proven that raising taxes on the rich slows the economy. As a businessman, I make very few decisions on my business based on taxes and increased taxes don't prevent me from trying to grow my business. I suspect the rich are the same way. They may make decisions about taxes, but usually not because of them.
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by menmon View Post
    Let me dumb it down a little bit.....most of our economic woes stem from the attack on the twin towers. Because of them, we have increased government to make the country safe, no increased revenue to pay for the additional safety....we just finish one costly war that we had no additional revenue to pay for....still in a war that we have not increased revenue to pay for.....economic terror. How best to hurt us but in our pocketbook.

    So if you want to know why the mighty dollar does not buy as much, it is because we keep running up our credit card and can only afford the minimum. Don't dare ask anyone to pay for it except the old and aflicted.

    Is that clear enough for you or do I need to dumb it down some more.
    Don't worry about it. the WHOLE post was dumb enough. I'm fairly sure you undestand this post.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by menmon View Post
    Private sector jobs have increased 4.5MM during his term while public sector jobs have declined, as he has cut spending. You want spending cuts; you get job cuts. Can't have both.

    The increase in the national debt is just to pay for what the yahoos before him spent and didn't pay for.

    Obamacare is funded...unlike presciption drug, tax cuts, Iraq and Afganistan. Looks to me like you republicans could learn something about fiscal responsibility from us democrats. You talk it but don't walk it.
    Go back and look at what happened in 1920. Unemployment at 35%! GDP dropped about 30%! Current Fed. budget at a little over 6 billion at the time and the marginal tax rate at 75%. Fed budget cut to less than 3 billion, marginal tax rete lowered to 25%. In less than 2 years, the economy came roaring back. Don't say it can't be done. IT HAS BEEN DONE. Those are FACTS!

  5. #25
    Senior Member menmon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caryalsobrook View Post
    Go back and look at what happened in 1920. Unemployment at 35%! GDP dropped about 30%! Current Fed. budget at a little over 6 billion at the time and the marginal tax rate at 75%. Fed budget cut to less than 3 billion, marginal tax rete lowered to 25%. In less than 2 years, the economy came roaring back. Don't say it can't be done. IT HAS BEEN DONE. Those are FACTS!
    1920 was not the great depression. My grandmother would differ with you.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by menmon View Post
    1920 was not the great depression. My grandmother would differ with you.
    What do yo know, you are right!! The unemployment was worse and the drop in GDP was worse, but the actions taken were different from 1930 and on. The economy was much worse in 1920 but the recovery was much much quicker, because the actions taken were different AND MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE as shown by the results. We recovered from the worse fall in unemployment and the worse drop in GDP in less than 2 years since 1900 BECAUSE policies were far different than in 1030 and those now. Keep these same failed policies and we can look forward to another 1930's economy. Don't take my word for it, just go back and look at what happened in 1920.

  7. #27
    Senior Member huntinman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caryalsobrook View Post
    What do yo know, you are right!! The unemployment was worse and the drop in GDP was worse, but the actions taken were different from 1930 and on. The economy was much worse in 1920 but the recovery was much much quicker, because the actions taken were different AND MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE as shown by the results. We recovered from the worse fall in unemployment and the worse drop in GDP in less than 2 years since 1900 BECAUSE policies were far different than in 1030 and those now. Keep these same failed policies and we can look forward to another 1930's economy. Don't take my word for it, just go back and look at what happened in 1920.
    Cary, it would be less painful if you just took a hammer and smashed your own toe...
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  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by huntinman View Post
    Cary, it would be less painful if you just took a hammer and smashed your own toe...
    Not too painful because it is nice when some recognize the FACTS. Frankly what works is more important to me than just the theory. I always try to avoid the classic statement that "history says we always avoid the lessons of history". 15 years of the great depression and some think that was good ecomomic policy of raising taxes and increasing gov. spending? Well it did get us out of the depression--IN 15 YEARS!!! Only problem is that a lot of us don't have 15 years or enough money to wait that long.

  9. #29
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    The Depression of 1920–21 was an extremely sharp deflationary recession in the United States, shortly after the end of World War I. It lasted from January 1920 to July 1921.[1] The extent of the deflation was not only large, but large relative to the accompanying decline in real product.[2]
    A range of factors have been identified contributing to the depression, many relating to adjustments in the economy following the end of World War I. There was a brief Post-World War I recession immediately following the end of the war which lasted for 7 months. The economy started to grow, though it had not yet completed all the adjustments in shifting from a wartime to a peacetime economy. Factors identified as potentially contributing to the downturn include: returning troops which created a surge in the civilian labor force, a decline in labor union strife, changes in fiscal and monetary policy, and changes in price expectations.
    Following the end of the Depression of 1920-21, the Roaring Twenties brought a period of economic prosperity.

  10. #30
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    The Great Depression was a severe worldwide economic depression in the decade preceding World War II. The timing of the Great Depression varied across nations, but in most countries it started in 1930 after the passage of the United States' Smoot-Hawley Tariff bill (June 17), and lasted until the late 1930s or middle 1940s.[1] It was the longest, most widespread, and deepest depression of the 20th century.[2]
    In the 21st century, the Great Depression is commonly used as an example of how far the world's economy can decline.[2] The depression originated in the U.S., after the fall in stock prices that began around September 4, 1929, and became worldwide news with the stock market crash of October 29, 1929 (known as Black Tuesday).
    The Great Depression had devastating effects in countries rich and poor. Personal income, tax revenue, profits and prices dropped, while international trade plunged by more than 50%, due in large part to the Smoot-Hawley Tariff. Unemployment in the U.S. rose to 25%, and in some countries rose as high as 33%.[3]
    Cities all around the world were hit hard, especially those dependent on heavy industry. Construction was virtually halted in many countries. Farming and rural areas suffered as crop prices fell by approximately 60%.[4][5][6] Facing plummeting demand with few alternate sources of jobs, areas dependent on primary sector industries such as cash cropping, mining and logging suffered the most.[7]
    Some economies started to recover by the mid-1930s. In many countries, the negative effects of the Great Depression lasted until the end of World War II.[8]
    Main article: Causes of the Great Depression



    There were multiple causes for the first downturn in 1929. These include the structural weaknesses and specific events that turned it into a major depression and the manner in which the downturn spread from country to country. In relation to the 1929 downturn, historians emphasize structural factors like major bank failures and the stock market crash. In contrast, monetarist economists (such as Barry Eichengreen, Milton Friedman and Peter Temin) point to monetary factors such as actions by the US Federal Reserve that contracted the money supply, as well as Britain's decision to return to the gold standard at pre–World War I parities (US$4.86:1).
    Recessions and business cycles are thought to be a normal part of living in a world of inexact balances between supply and demand. What turns a normal recession or 'ordinary' business cycle into a depression is a subject of much debate and concern. Scholars have not agreed on the exact causes and their relative importance. The search for causes is closely connected to the issue of avoiding future depressions.
    Thus, the personal political and policy viewpoints of scholars greatly color their analysis of historic events occurring eight decades ago.[citation needed] An even larger question is whether the Great Depression was primarily a failure on the part of free markets or a failure of government efforts to regulate interest rates, curtail widespread bank failures, and control the money supply. Those who believe in a larger economic role for the state believe that it was primarily a failure of free markets, while those who believe in a smaller role for the state believe that it was primarily a failure of government that compounded the problem.[citation needed]
    Current theories may be broadly classified into two main points of view and several heterodox points of view. There are demand-driven theories, most importantly Keynesian economics, but also including those who point to the breakdown of international trade, and Institutional economists who point to underconsumption and over-investment (causing an economic bubble), malfeasance by bankers and industrialists, or incompetence by government officials. The consensus among demand-driven theories is that a large-scale loss of confidence led to a sudden reduction in consumption and investment spending. Once panic and deflation set in, many people believed they could avoid further losses by keeping clear of the markets. Holding money became profitable as prices dropped lower and a given amount of money bought ever more goods, exacerbating the drop in demand.
    There are the monetarists, who believe that the Great Depression started as an ordinary recession, but that significant policy mistakes by monetary authorities (especially the Federal Reserve), caused a shrinking of the money supply which greatly exacerbated the economic situation, causing a recession to descend into the Great Depression. Related to this explanation are those who point to debt deflation causing those who borrow to owe ever more in real terms.
    There are also various heterodox theories that downplay or reject the explanations of the Keynesians and monetarists. For example, some new classical macroeconomists have argued that various labor market policies imposed at the start caused the length and severity of the Great Depression. The Austrian school of economics focuses on the macroeconomic effects of money supply, and how central banking decisions can lead to over-investment (economic bubble).

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