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Thread: How Factors Effect Dogs

  1. #51
    Senior Member bruce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RetrieversONLINE View Post
    PS. I disagree with the philosphy of some HRC judges that penalize a dog on a blind for smelling the bird and going to it even if it is only 2-3 feet. That is not hunting up the bird, that is putting the dog where he can scoop up the bird in a few feet.
    Sorry off topic but ... I don't think that HRC judges penalize the dog for using it's nose but rather for lacking control and slipping a whistle at or near the finish of the blind because they smell the bird. The blind retrieve is all about control in a test situation control to the Bird ,,, not to the area and establish a hunt ... HRC has four levels of control Started, Seasoned, Finished and Grand ... the HRC Philosophy can be discovered in the Judges Handlers Seminar pamphlet at the Huntungretieverclub.org home page ... a refusal is a refusl no matter where it happens in route to the recovery of the blind ...
    Last edited by bruce; 10-04-2012 at 08:45 PM.
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  2. #52
    Senior Member John Kelder's Avatar
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    If you were asked to speak on only one factor(terrain, cover, wind, lighting) and emphasize the most important thing to be aware of as a Handler, what would it be?
    Cindy Von Sutphen
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  3. #53
    Senior Member Gunner's Dad's Avatar
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    While not the biggest issue i have had light really effect my dog. More like a shadow. We were in a field with a thick tree line. Blind was at one end of the field with a shadow going across the field. the dog ran the shadow every time, for a least a second or two he would break his line to try and stay in the sun. AT first i thought it was something else pulling him, smell or something, but on different days and times he will run the shadow. Weird stuff.
    Benjamin Fain

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by bruce View Post
    Sorry off topic but ... I don't think that HRC judges penalize the dog for using it's nose but rather for lacking control and slipping a whistle at or near the finish of the blind because they smell the bird. The blind retrieve is all about control in a test situation control to the Bird ,,, not to the area and establish a hunt ... HRC has four levels of control Started, Seasoned, Finished and Grand ... the HRC Philosophy can be discovered in the Judges Handlers Seminar pamphlet at the Huntungretieverclub.org home page ... a refusal is a refusl no matter where it happens in route to the recovery of the blind ...
    Yes, and I too disagree with that philosophy. 2-3 feet straight to the bird is not establishing a hunt IMO. If that last 2-3 feet of a finished or grand blind is the only opportunity for the handler to display, and for the judges to evaluate control, then wasn't it a poorly set up blind?

  5. #55
    Senior Member bruce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by captainjack View Post
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    Yes, and I too disagree with that philosophy. 2-3 feet straight to the bird is not establishing a hunt IMO. If that last 2-3 feet of a finished or grand blind is the only opportunity for the handler to display, and for the judges to evaluate control, then wasn't it a poorly set up blind?
    Again off subject but ... I'd see it as handler error for giving a sit command that the dog then auto-casted out of on scent. If the dog is within 2-3 feet and you blow that is a conscious decision on the part of the handler and if that whistle is slipped disobedience on the part of the dog. If a dog winds a blind at 100 yards or within feet and refuses a whistle en-route and continues to the blind without further intervention on his own it is a refusal plan and simple. Has he exhibited finished control or a great nose who works independently of the handler? not necessarily in and of itself a disqualifier but recorded as a refusal ... when added to the overall performance may be the straw that changed a passing to a marginal performance or a marginal to a failing performance, ... "handle to the bird" ... nothing about establishing a hunt, simply blow [handler], sit [dog], cast [handler] recover bird [dog], and praise [handler] ... in my book lining the blind is the ultimate control ...
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  6. #56
    Senior Member Howard N's Avatar
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    If the dog is within 2-3 feet and you blow that is a conscious decision on the part of the handler and if that whistle is slipped disobedience on the part of the dog.
    I would think most trial judges would think of a whistle after you've gotten your dog to within a yard of the blind as a check whistle to ensure your dog doesn't overrun the blind.
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  7. #57
    Senior Member Ted Shih's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bruce View Post

    If the dog is within 2-3 feet and you blow that is a conscious decision on the part of the handler and if that whistle is slipped disobedience on the part of the dog. If a dog winds a blind at 100 yards or within feet and refuses a whistle en-route and continues to the blind without further intervention on his own it is a refusal plan and simple.
    I disagree. As a judge, my response is identical to Rhett Butler's retort to Scarlett O'Hara "Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn."
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  8. #58
    Senior Member bruce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Howard N View Post
    I would think most trial judges would think of a whistle after you've gotten your dog to within a yard of the blind as a check whistle to ensure your dog doesn't overrun the blind.
    Still off topic ... Howard can't agree more in Trails and if Ted as a FT Judge gives a hoot or not does not reflect on the original statement regarding HRC Judging philosophy ... A refusal in HRC is a refusal and should recorded as such and the total of the work be judged to meet the standard or not ... unless you expect the person in the chair to be able to interpret intent on the handler's part by distance remaining to the recovery of the blind ... clear and black and white vs ambiguous and grey judgement ... ok I'm done bash away as you deem fit ... back to lurking ...
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  9. #59
    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    If the dog is within 2-3 feet and you blow that is a conscious decision on the part of the handler and if that whistle is slipped disobedience on the part of the dog.

    I believe that most HRC Judges would mark on their sheet "DAHW" (DumbArse handler whistle)

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  10. #60
    Senior Member Ted Shih's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bruce View Post
    Still off topic ... Howard can't agree more in Trails and if Ted as a FT Judge gives a hoot or not does not reflect on the original statement regarding HRC Judging philosophy ... A refusal in HRC is a refusal and should recorded as such and the total of the work be judged to meet the standard or not ... unless you expect the person in the chair to be able to interpret intent on the handler's part by distance remaining to the recovery of the blind ... clear and black and white vs ambiguous and grey judgement ... ok I'm done bash away as you deem fit ... back to lurking ...

    It is so insignificant as to be meaningless to me. There are far more important matters to review.
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