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Thread: Hunt test distance change for master

  1. #101
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    I don't necessarily mind the distant change, but I thought the wording could have been improved, new rules state

    "1. Distance in Master Tests. Test distances in the Master level test
    should not normally exceed 150 yards. (Previously 100 yards.)"

    Why not say, "Should not exceed 150 yards" vice "Should not normally"...


    How far is "not normally"?

  2. #102
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    I think it would be interesting if judges were assigned to judge hunt tests at random and the clubs did not have choice to dictate over who was assigned to what test. Also, no choice in the pairing of judges. In some ways, this is like allowing a football team to chose which referee runs the game?

    my wacko-thought of the day...

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by marion View Post
    I feel like it is a move to push out the small amateur. Someone like me with one or two dogs, not a lot of money, not a lot of access to technical water and large areas, no machine to run out marks. The move is to limit the number of dogs that can pass and it is done by getting rid of the small guys. Field trials are a rich man' game. This moves Hunt tests in that direction.

    The change was made with little effort to consult with the clubs on the ground.

    Sorry to be dismal but not only the change but the handling of it make it seem like a repeat of the changes that happened with Field trials even though there is already a the field trail venue for people who want it that way.

    Marion Amidon
    My point exactly!

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  4. #104
    Senior Member fishduck's Avatar
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    As I posted earlier, bring on the distance. An issue I see is the constant use of training set ups used as tests. Teaching and proofing set ups used by pros are working their way into the testing framework. Access to technical water is almost a prerequisite to obtaining a MH. If adding distance will mitigate the technical aspect of the game then I am all for it.

    The same complaints that spawned the hunt test movement are now directed at the upper level tests. Fewer and fewer true owner/trainer/handlers are around. This was not meant to be a spectator sport.

    I very much appreciate every judge that gives up their weekend to sit in a chair with little reward except watching good dog work. Without judges that give of their time, these games cannot continue. Have we evolved to the point that a dedicated hunter training a good dog on lakes and round stock ponds is relegated to owning a JH?
    Mark Land

  5. #105
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    If adding distance will mitigate the technical aspect of the game then I am all for it.
    I think that is a very big and wrong assumption!

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by dixidawg View Post
    I think that is a very big and wrong assumption!
    I have been wrong & wrong headed so many times in my short time training dogs that is very possible. I would hope that with the addition of distance some of the super tight areas of fall and technical tests would no longer be necessary.

    I have listened to many complaints from the gallery. Never heard any complaints about distance.
    Mark Land

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul "Happy" Gilmore View Post
    I think it would be interesting if judges were assigned to judge hunt tests at random and the clubs did not have choice to dictate over who was assigned to what test. Also, no choice in the pairing of judges. In some ways, this is like allowing a football team to chose which referee runs the game?

    my wacko-thought of the day...
    As a judge I would agree to do that if the judges were not assigned until AFTER the closing of the test!

    If I am going to spend the weekend watching dogs, it's going to be with someone I like.
    Tom Dorroh

  8. #108
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul "Happy" Gilmore View Post
    I think it would be interesting if judges were assigned to judge hunt tests at random and the clubs did not have choice to dictate over who was assigned to what test. Also, no choice in the pairing of judges. In some ways, this is like allowing a football team to chose which referee runs the game?

    my wacko-thought of the day...
    GOOD DOG MAN, have you never been on a hunt-test committee that had to deal with judges who don't get on and bicker-bicker all day? I have it's terrible, setup take 3 times longer to setup, sometimes you got to setup something one told you just to take it down, then we got to call in committee members to referee. The day takes forever, Everyone suffers. Particularly the dogs-handlers who have to wait 2-3 hr. after dark while judges have it out in a car on who should pass and who should not, Each refusing to compromise, thus only 4-5 dogs getting passed out of 15 that went to the last series, most who it might've gone one way or the other, but you can't pass a dog with only one judges signature. Then you get to deal with upset handlers (NEVER AGAIN)
    Last edited by Hunt'EmUp; 11-05-2012 at 01:35 PM.
    "They's Just DAWGS"
    "Hunting is a skill to be learned whether you do it early or late it still needs to be learned"
    "I train dogs, Not papers"

    GMRH HRCH Quick MH (most importantly Duck/Upland Enthusiast)
    MHR HRCH Lakota MH (most importantly Upland/Duck Enthusiast)
    SHR Storm.. the Pup (Beginning Upland & Waterfowl Enthusiast)

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishduck View Post
    I have been wrong & wrong headed so many times in my short time training dogs that is very possible. I would hope that with the addition of distance some of the super tight areas of fall and technical tests would no longer be necessary.

    I have listened to many complaints from the gallery. Never heard any complaints about distance.
    Mark, I wish I could say that you are correct, however, I bet we will still see tight marks, overlapping AOF, only at a longer distance. We both run a lot of HT and see judges who no longer train their own dogs or train with pro occasionally. They don't know and can't predict what the factors will be on test day and then we can have bad tests. The judges I like to run under the best are the ones who are good trainers and still train their own dogs. When training with a pro, some see a set up and file away for next judging assignment no matter if the grounds or wind or lighting allow it to be a good test or not.
    Only solution for is to train to a much higher level than the standard and hope it is your lucky weekend.
    I believe we are headed to FT's without placements unless the wording is changed from "should" to "shall" and is reenforced by the committee.
    JMHO
    MP

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hunt'EmUp View Post
    GOOD DOG MAN, have you never been on a hunt-test committee that had to deal with judges who don't get on and bicker-bicker all day? I have it's terrible, setup take 3 times longer to setup, sometimes you got to setup something one told you just to take it down, then we got to call in committee members to referee. The day takes forever, Everyone suffers. Particularly the dogs-handlers who have to wait 2-3 hr. after dark while judges have it out in a car on who should pass and who should not, Each refusing to compromise, thus only 4-5 dogs getting passed out of 15 that went to the last series, who it might've gone one way or the other. Then you get to deal with upset handlers (NEVER AGAIN)
    Just wish there was a better method of getting judges on the same page without having it be a requirement to have them be "Buddies" and see "Eye to Eye" on their differences to get a test set up and judged efficiently to get the day completed in a manner which is fair and follows the "standards".

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