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Thread: A world of Genetics vs. Real World Experience

  1. #1
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    Default A world of Genetics vs. Real World Experience

    We all know the stats from the genetics school book on how color is inherited Yellow x Black (yellow carrier) = 50% Black-%50 Yellow, Brown x Black (brown carrier)= 50%-50%. Black(yellow carrier)x Black (yellow carrier) = 75% black, 25% yellow. Simple right? Same with the Chocolates. We'll as I've been watching a few litters this year, toying with the idea of trying a new color, but not yet insane enough to eliminate a black parent completely . I've found they are nowhere close to schoolbook. So I thought it might be fun to get some real world stats based on color breeding from personal experience, see if we can get them to balance out to 50%.

    So here goes this year so far

    Yellow x black ( Y carrier) = 8 black 3 yellow
    Chocolate x black (coco carrier) = 5 black 1 chocolate
    Black(Y carrier) x black (y-carrier) = 7 black

    So far all signs pointing to me staying with black
    Last edited by Hunt'EmUp; 11-27-2012 at 01:09 PM.
    "They's Just DAWGS"
    "Hunting is a skill to be learned whether you do it early or late it still needs to be learned"
    "I train dogs, Not papers"

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  2. #2
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    That is a tiny sample size
    The larger your sample size the closer you will hit the mathematical norms

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    Senior Member PalouseDogs's Avatar
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    Plenty of parents out there with 9 girls because they weren't gonna give up until they got a boy (or vice-versa).

    There's a reason geneticists work with fruit flies....
    Kelly Cassidy (person)

    HR Maple Cassidy CDX JH RE (golden retriever)
    Alder Cassidy CDX RE (standard poodle chipmunk chaser)
    plus whacked-out weird Burka (elderly mix-breed rescue girl)

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    Senior Member Montview's Avatar
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    It is also not a typical Punnett square type situation. The percentages are the likelihood of each puppy in a litter being a particular color.... not a percentage of each litter. It sounds the same but it is definitely not.

    Oh, and I think you should go play some money on black in a good game of roulette!
    -Julie, Monty (2005 YLM), Rogue (2009 BLM), and Eddy (2013 BLM)

    "To err is human, to forgive, canine." - Anon

    LIFE IS GOOD. "Do what you like, like what you do."

  5. #5
    Senior Member Bally's Gun Dogs's Avatar
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    I agree to go bet on black...

    Two litters we have had of mixed colors
    Black (chocolate carrier) X Chocolate 4 chocolate 4 black...better part of that was 6 females and 2 males (also theoretically a 50/50 chance each pup is male or female)
    Black (yellow carrier) X Yellow 1 yellow 6 males
    Black (chocolate carrier) X Chocolate Due Christmas Day we will see what we get

    Two litters same mating we have bought pups out of
    Black (yellow carrier) X Black (yellow carrier)
    Mating 1
    4 yellow and 2 black
    Mating 2
    6 black
    ~Cortney Bally~

    Home of:
    HRCH Fairwinds Bayou Boogie Woogie WCX MH *** (10/05)
    HRCH Elm Creek's' Koa WCX MH (07/07)
    HRCH Nebo's Uptown Girl MH *** (04/08)
    HR Bally's What Else But Hunt WCX SH *** (11/09)
    HR Bally's What Happens In Vegas WC SH *** (02/10)
    HR Bally's Swinging For The Fence SH *** (08/10)
    HRCH Bally's Best Blonde Joke JH (03/12)

  6. #6
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    Litter 1 – Black (chocolate factored) X Black (chocolate factored) = 13 pups, 9 black, 4 chocolate
    Repeat litter 2 - 6 pups, 5 black, 1 chocolate
    Repeat litter 3 - 13 pups, 5 black, 8 chocolate

    My conclusion….
    Color = Unpredictable
    Accepting deposits expecting a large litter = small litter
    Turning down deposits expecting small litter = large litter
    Receiving more male deposits = more females
    Receiving more female deposits = more males
    Interest for black = chocolate
    Interset for chocolate = black
    Last edited by Brandon Bromley; 11-28-2012 at 10:31 AM.

  7. #7
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    Litter 1) Chocolate stud x Black bitch (chocolate factored), 9 chocolate, 1 black

    Liter 2) Black stud (chocolate factored) x Chocolate bitch (from Litter 1) 1 chocolate, 9 black
    “Don't raise your voice, improve your argument" Desmond Tutu

  8. #8
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    How about this: Same male dog
    litter 1: Black Male (Yellow factored) x black female (yellow Factored) = 9 pups all black
    litter 2: Black Male (Yellow factored) x black female (yellow Factored) = 9 pups all black
    litter 3: Black Male (Yellow factored) x chocolate female (yellow Factored) = 6 pups all black
    litter 4: Black Male (Yellow factored) x yellow female (yellow Factored) = 10 pups all black
    litter 5: Black Male (Yellow factored) x chocolate female (yellow Factored) = 8 pups all black
    litter 6: Black Male (Yellow factored) x black female (yellow Factored) = 11 pups all black, all litters were born in a 6 year span with 6 different females !

  9. #9
    Senior Member Bally's Gun Dogs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sportnclays View Post
    How about this: Same male dog
    litter 1: Black Male (Yellow factored) x black female (yellow Factored) = 9 pups all black
    litter 2: Black Male (Yellow factored) x black female (yellow Factored) = 9 pups all black
    litter 3: Black Male (Yellow factored) x chocolate female (yellow Factored) = 6 pups all black
    litter 4: Black Male (Yellow factored) x yellow female (yellow Factored) = 10 pups all black
    litter 5: Black Male (Yellow factored) x chocolate female (yellow Factored) = 8 pups all black
    litter 6: Black Male (Yellow factored) x black female (yellow Factored) = 11 pups all black, all litters were born in a 6 year span with 6 different females !
    Was the male tested for the yellow gene?
    ~Cortney Bally~

    Home of:
    HRCH Fairwinds Bayou Boogie Woogie WCX MH *** (10/05)
    HRCH Elm Creek's' Koa WCX MH (07/07)
    HRCH Nebo's Uptown Girl MH *** (04/08)
    HR Bally's What Else But Hunt WCX SH *** (11/09)
    HR Bally's What Happens In Vegas WC SH *** (02/10)
    HR Bally's Swinging For The Fence SH *** (08/10)
    HRCH Bally's Best Blonde Joke JH (03/12)

  10. #10
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    Hmmm I'm envisioning a new retriever game, guessing litter color, so far it's appearing Black is the best bet, then a Yellow, then chocolate. If we give odds on this that 9 chocolate:1 black would be quite a pay-out

    I also have experience with a black male tested yellow carrier, shoot he was out of the yellow female, only ever produced one still born yellow in multiple breedings to different yellow females. I guess the black ones just swam faster

    Anyone dare to put odds on a tri-factor breeding?
    Last edited by Hunt'EmUp; 11-28-2012 at 01:49 PM.
    "They's Just DAWGS"
    "Hunting is a skill to be learned whether you do it early or late it still needs to be learned"
    "I train dogs, Not papers"

    GMRH HRCH Quick MH (most importantly Duck/Upland Enthusiast)
    MHR HRCH Lakota MH (most importantly Upland/Duck Enthusiast)
    SHR Storm.. the Pup (Beginning Upland & Waterfowl Enthusiast)

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