The RetrieverTraining.Net Forums The Retriever Academy
Total Retriever Training with Mike Lardy
Hawkeye Media Gunners Up Tritronics Outdoor Media
Page 6 of 13 FirstFirst ... 45678 ... LastLast
Results 51 to 60 of 128

Thread: What's the Point, Part 2

  1. #51
    Senior Member John Robinson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Bigfork, Montana
    Posts
    3,275

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RookieTrainer View Post
    As a Devil's advocate for a moment . . . .

    I think we would all agree that the first requirement is a dog who can be a competitive FT dog. I think we would also agree that the best way to go about this is to acquire such a dog at a cost of somewhere around $2000. Then, for most of us, the dog would go to a pro to determine if it in fact was a competitive FT dog. At least 6 months at somewhere between $700 - $1000 a month, or another $4200 - $6000. This does not count food, vet bills, etc.

    Now, with all that money and expertise having gone into the dog and its training, why would I handle it?

    Put another way, could I take Jimmie Johnson's race car and get the same or better results than Jimmie? With the same exact car? Racing against other NASCAR drivers?

    It's possible that I could outrace those guys, but not very likely.
    It depends on whether you are thinking long or short term. If you are thinking short term, maybe want to get on the derby list and or get as many derby points as possible, then have your pro run the dog in the derby. If you want to become a better all age handler, develop as a team with your dog and have success in the all age when the dog is five or six, then get as much time on line as possible when you have a better chance of going four series.

    John

  2. #52
    Senior Member John Robinson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Bigfork, Montana
    Posts
    3,275

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Wade View Post
    Don't get into the sport then is what I would say. Again, What's the point if you are not going to run your own dog. Where is the pleasure in having someone compete with your dog?

    I'm not saying don't use a pro, there is nothing wrong with having them take the dog and train it for a few months. However, to sit on the side lines while the game is being played isn't fun at all. How does one get enjoyment from that?
    Wade, there are many people (I'm not one of them), that get a lot of pleasure just owning a successful dog. I imagine this is similar to the way a race horse owner feels about their horse.

  3. #53
    Senior Member EdA's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    6,867

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by John Montenieri View Post
    I agree. We have an excellent training group and a varied amount of experience. Everyone there cheers our group when things go right, a little bit of ribbing when they don't.
    What almost no one outside the group knows is that the group collectively cheer for each other and view individual accomplishment as a group accomplishment which is very very refreshing in today's "me" world. This was Holland's first summer in his young life away from CO and the training group yet he/I received, privately or publicly, congratulations from everyone in the group for him being a Finalist. As one person told me we all cheered when we heard the news because "he is one of our team".

    How cool is that?

  4. #54
    Senior Member Wade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    1,250

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by John Robinson View Post
    Wade, there are many people (I'm not one of them), that get a lot of pleasure just owning a successful dog. I imagine this is similar to the way a race horse owner feels about their horse.
    John, I didn't mean to sound harsh there. I just think that if you can run your dog run your dog. The Minors are a great place for new people to do that.
    I hate rude behavior in a man, won't tolerate it. Captain Woodrow Call

  5. #55
    Senior Member Wade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    1,250

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EdA View Post
    What almost no one outside the group knows is that the group collectively cheer for each other and view individual accomplishment as a group accomplishment which is very very refreshing in today's "me" world. This was Holland's first summer in his young life away from CO and the training group yet he/I received, privately or publicly, congratulations from everyone in the group for him being a Finalist. As one person told me we all cheered when we heard the news because "he is one of our team".

    How cool is that?
    Pretty neat Ed. pretty neat!!
    I hate rude behavior in a man, won't tolerate it. Captain Woodrow Call

  6. #56
    Senior Member 8mmag's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Clarkston, Michigan
    Posts
    329

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MooseGooser View Post
    I will beat Ted someday!!,,, Lainee Too,, Maontenrarieee too or how ever Ya spell it,,, Even that other guy with the clean truck..
    Ahhh, got the fire lit now...



    Quote Originally Posted by MooseGooser View Post
    My first step, is getting a well trained dog.. I have my hands FULL!!!!!!!!! I'm not going to look forward to next weeks game... I have to concentrate very hard, on what Homework I have been given for the week..

    When I get that well trained dog,, we will see what happens..

    Gooser

    Now you have both a goal AND a plan! As you work toward getting that well trained dawg, there are two other things you can work on simultaneously that will help that well trained dawg succeed. Your handling skills and becoming a team with with yer dawg.
    Tom Rogers; Owned and Handled by Al Capone's Magic Patriot Son - Riot
    [FC/AFC Big Alfonse Capone of Mo-Kan x Dominators Magic Avalon]

    R.I.P. Grandpaws FC AFC HRCH Taylorlab Downtown "Dusty" Brown MH & FC CFC CAFC Taylorlabs "Magic" Trick MH CD
    Riot's Career
    on EE

  7. #57
    Senior Member RookieTrainer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    West Central AL
    Posts
    1,251

    Default

    I hear you, and I think you are at least partially right.

    However, not included in the above calculations is the cost of the time off from work to train and trial. If I am not at my desk, I am not making money.

    In the short term or the long term, it would be light years more economically efficient for me to specialize in my business and let an FT pro specialize in his. I pay to have my grass cut because I can use the 2 hours it would take me to do it to make much more money than it costs me. Same principle would apply here. Why would I not extend it on to handling the dog? And don't forget that I would likely not even be considered for a pup from a really good breeding without a commitment to send the pup to a really good trainer for about a year.

    Let me also say that I do not have an FT dog, likely will not have one, and probably don't want one precisely because of the reasons cited above. I don't think I would ever have time to get good enough as a handler to do a talented dog real justice, mainly because I have other things I like to do too (Alabama football games, anyone?), and I am not sure I could just be a dog owner with the dog spending nearly all his time with a pro.

    Quote Originally Posted by John Robinson View Post
    It depends on whether you are thinking long or short term. If you are thinking short term, maybe want to get on the derby list and or get as many derby points as possible, then have your pro run the dog in the derby. If you want to become a better all age handler, develop as a team with your dog and have success in the all age when the dog is five or six, then get as much time on line as possible when you have a better chance of going four series.

    John
    Last edited by RookieTrainer; 11-29-2012 at 03:27 PM.

  8. #58
    Senior Member John Robinson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Bigfork, Montana
    Posts
    3,275

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Wade View Post
    John, I didn't mean to sound harsh there. I just think that if you can run your dog run your dog. The Minors are a great place for new people to do that.
    I agree with you, but that doesn't mean that those folks who don't run their dog for whatever reason are wrong. Kind of on the same note I was fortunate to have learned under a pro, Eric Fangsrud, who coaches and encourages his handlers from early on to run their own dogs, not all pros are like that. I think for the most part, folks who don't run their own dog are a bit, ok very intimidated and are afraid to stand out there for all to see on line. If I could talk to them I would try to calm them and encourage them to take that big step to the line, though some people are better under pressure than others. I certainly don't hold it against them if they don't feel up to it.

    John

  9. #59
    Senior Member John Robinson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Bigfork, Montana
    Posts
    3,275

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RookieTrainer View Post
    I hear you, and I think you are at least partially right.

    However, not included in the above calculations is the cost of the time off from work to train and trial. If I am not at my desk, I am not making money.

    In the short term or the long term, it would be light years more economically efficient for me to specialize in my business and let an FT pro specialize in his. I pay to have my grass cut because I can use the 2 hours it would take me to do it to make much more money than it costs me. Same principle would apply here. Why would I not extend it on to handling the dog? And don't forget that I would likely not even be considered for a pup from a really good breeding without a commitment to send the pup to a really good trainer for about a year.

    Let me also say that I do not have an FT dog, likely will not have one, and probably don't want one precisely because of the reasons cited above. I don't think I would ever have time to get good enough as a handler to do a talented dog real justice, mainly because I have other things I like to do too (Alabama football games, anyone?), and I am not sure I could just be a dog owner with the dog spending nearly all his time with a pro.
    OK there's another reason for not handling your own dog, I get that. There are many times I miss all the fishing, hiking, flying, sailing, you-name-it I used to do before becoming obsessed with dog training and trialing. It is a huge sacrifice. If you just want a well trained dog that gets quality work year around and don't want to sacrifice other things including work, football or family, hiring a pro is pefectly legit, not that you need anybody's approval.

    For those of us who are obsessed, we are obviously not thinking this through in economical terms, I'd put a bullit in my head if I did that.
    John

  10. #60
    Senior Member kjrice's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Las Vegas, NV
    Posts
    2,410

    Default

    Who cares? Everyone has a choice to run or not run their dog as they see fit. I know what I prefer but don't lose sleep over another's choice.
    Last edited by kjrice; 11-29-2012 at 04:25 PM.
    A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •