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Thread: Libya ... the plot thickens

  1. #1
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    Default Libya ... the plot thickens

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/06/wo...it_th_20121206

    From the NY Times ...

    So, it seems that the US was also sending arms to Libyan rebels through a "surrogate" country (Qatar), but it seems that the arms ended up in the hands of the wrong people. The article says there is no evidence that these weapons were involved in the 9/11/12 Benghazi debacle. Not too surprising since it was weeks before anyone got to investigate the scene of the crime. Might also provide a "motive" for not bailing out the beseiged Americans that night.

    But in the months before, the Obama administration clearly was worried about the consequences of its hidden hand in helping arm Libyan militants, concerns that have not previously been reported. The weapons and money from Qatar strengthened militant groups in Libya, allowing them to become a destabilizing force since the fall of the Qaddafi government.
    The Obama administration did not initially raise objections when Qatar began shipping arms to opposition groups in Syria, even if it did not offer encouragement, according to current and former administration officials. But they said the United States has growing concerns that, just as in Libya, the Qataris are equipping some of the wrong militants.
    Geez! Suckered twice.

    Fast & Furious with a MidEast flavor?
    The administration has never determined where all of the weapons, paid for by Qatar and the United Arab Emirates, went inside Libya, officials said. Qatar is believed to have shipped by air and sea small arms, including machine guns, automatic rifles, and ammunition, for which it has demanded reimbursement from Libya’s new government. Some of the arms since have been moved from Libya to militants with ties to Al Qaeda in Mali, where radical jihadi factions have imposed Shariah law in the northern part of the country, the former Defense Department official said. Others have gone to Syria, according to several American and foreign officials and arms traders.
    American officials say that the United Arab Emirates first approached the Obama administration during the early months of the Libyan uprising, asking for permission to ship American-built weapons that the United States had supplied for the emirates’ use. The administration rejected that request, but instead urged the emirates to ship weapons to Libya that could not be traced to the United States.
    But the American support for the arms shipments from Qatar and the emirates could not be completely hidden. NATO air and sea forces around Libya had to be alerted not to interdict the cargo planes and freighters transporting the arms into Libya from Qatar and the emirates, American officials said.
    The bad guys in the ME must be laughing up their sleeves at how stupid Americans are.

    Meanwhile, Morsi in Egypt is looking like a worse despot than Mubarack was; and Assad has been mixing up nerve gas (which he says that he does not intend to use on his own people ... does that mean he plans to use it on somebody else?)

    Sure does reinforce the case for letting these guys fight out their own tribal wars.

    Also not too surprising that this stuff is only being reported now that the election is over.
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
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  2. #2
    Senior Member JDogger's Avatar
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    Double, double toil and trouble;
    Fire burn, and caldron bubble.
    Cool it with a baboon's blood,
    Then the charm is firm and good.

    JD
    One cannot reason someone out of something they were not reasoned into. - Jonathan Swift

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    Senior Member Pals's Avatar
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    Typical display of Americans not caring that their own were left to be tortured and killed in a hostile country by terroists and a Corrupt Administration. Thank you Hugh for your continued lack of decency. You could have just ignored this instead of acting like a 2 year old. Gerry did not deserve that response, she always makes informed posts that are thought provoking and she can back up what she posts. You on the other hand.....

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    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    Nursry rhymes!!!
    Finally a thread that drops down to Goosers intellect!!!

    JD,,,

    Heres a more appropriate one for ya!!

    Look up the Historical meaning of this rhyme.. Piracy,, and being duped!!


    Sing a song of sixpence a pocket full of rye,
    Four and twenty blackbirds baked in a pie.
    When the pie was opened the birds began to sing,
    Oh wasn't that a dainty
    dish
    to set before the king?
    The king was in his counting house counting out his
    money
    ,
    The queen was in the parlour eating bread and honey
    The maid was in the
    garden
    hanging out the clothes,
    When down came a blackbird and pecked off her nose!
    It is far easier to spit on the work of others than it is to produce something better yourself.
    Brynmoors Prairie Sage JH ​(Sage) Just a dang fool huntin Dawg
    HRCH Calypso Seven Bales High SH (Bailey)
    HR Calypso Zoomin Loosies Mad Hader (Maddi) We loved you baby. R.I.P.
    FlatLanders Broken Pistol Ricochet SH (Flinch)


    My Christian Name is Michael Baker..
    I have gone by "Gooser" since I was a "gossling"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerry Clinchy View Post
    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/06/wo...it_th_20121206

    From the NY Times ...

    So, it seems that the US was also sending arms to Libyan rebels through a "surrogate" country (Qatar), but it seems that the arms ended up in the hands of the wrong people. The article says there is no evidence that these weapons were involved in the 9/11/12 Benghazi debacle. Not too surprising since it was weeks before anyone got to investigate the scene of the crime. Might also provide a "motive" for not bailing out the beseiged Americans that night.



    Geez! Suckered twice.

    Fast & Furious with a MidEast flavor?


    The bad guys in the ME must be laughing up their sleeves at how stupid Americans are.

    Meanwhile, Morsi in Egypt is looking like a worse despot than Mubarack was; and Assad has been mixing up nerve gas (which he says that he does not intend to use on his own people ... does that mean he plans to use it on somebody else?)

    Sure does reinforce the case for letting these guys fight out their own tribal wars.

    Also not too surprising that this stuff is only being reported now that the election is over.
    Are you really surprised by this? This is nothing new in terms of long term American policy. The US has been and continues to be, by far, the largest supplier of military weapons to the world (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arms_industry). The fact that some of these weapons end up in the wrong hands is nothing new. How selective do you want the U.S. and U.S arms dealers to be when selling their Billions of dollars of weapons to foreign entities each year?

    Also, you do realize that policies that led to the fast and furious operation started in 2006 under the Bush administration, right?

  6. #6
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    With this additional background, do we still believe that the POTUS (and/or his high-level staff) did not make the decisions of what action to take (or not take) that night?

    It is inconceivable to me that when this was going down, the POTUS would not have been in the melee. If that were not the case, one might be asking exactly who is then in charge when an ambassador's life hangs in the balance? After all, the Times is reporting that the POTUS was well aware of the shipments of arms to rebel forces and concerned about leaving no "fingerprints".

    Reminds me, too, that Hillary mentioned that Amb Stevens was also a "friend". With friends like that, who needs enemies?
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
    "Know in your heart that all things are possible. We couldn't conceive of a miracle if none ever happened." -Libby Fudim

    ​I don't use the PM feature, so just email me direct at the address shown above.

  7. #7
    Senior Member starjack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDogger View Post
    Double, double toil and trouble;
    Fire burn, and caldron bubble.
    Cool it with a baboon's blood,
    Then the charm is firm and good.

    JD
    What.............

  8. #8
    Senior Member Uncle Bill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry V View Post

    Also, you do realize that policies that led to the fast and furious operation started in 2006 under the Bush administration, right?

    More MISINFORMATION you and your ilk continue to spew. If you don't know the facts...you just spew whatever feels good by your inept reasoning. but when I point that type of bullcrap out, everyone goes ballistic about my not sticking to facts. Well as hyopcrites go, you win the prize.

    UB
    When the one you love becomes a memory, that memory becomes a treasure.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Bill View Post
    More MISINFORMATION you and your ilk continue to spew. If you don't know the facts...you just spew whatever feels good by your inept reasoning. but when I point that type of bullcrap out, everyone goes ballistic about my not sticking to facts. Well as hyopcrites go, you win the prize.

    UB
    There you go again........ let me dumb it down for you, Google "wide receiver gun walking", even your beloved FoxNews covered it.

    Here I'll dumb it down for you further, here's a link. http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011...gun-operation/

    Are you and Rush dipping from the same prescription bottle?
    Last edited by mngundog; 12-07-2012 at 02:03 PM.

  10. #10
    Senior Member huntinman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDogger View Post
    Double, double toil and trouble;
    Fire burn, and caldron bubble.
    Cool it with a baboon's blood,
    Then the charm is firm and good.

    JD
    Must have legalized some really good stuff in NM...
    Bill Davis

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