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Thread: Angles in water!!!!!!!

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    Member wild timber kennels's Avatar
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    Default Angles in water!!!!!!!

    Can someone help me with some drills in water to help dog with angle cast? She has been water forced water t wagon wheel casting run awesome land blind at any distance hits her angles on land perfect!
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    Senior Member Tim McGarry's Avatar
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    What drills did you do to teach angle casting on land? Find a place to set up those same teaching drills on water.
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    A water tune-up will help this....

    Angie

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    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    ForumGeneral ForumsRTF - Retriever Training Forum Tune-Up Drills

    http://www.retrievertraining.net/for...Tune-Up-Drills
    Last edited by MooseGooser; 12-14-2012 at 06:21 PM.
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    Senior Member Nate_C's Avatar
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    If I understand you you are not talking about angled entries but angle casts right? Tune up drill is great for working on angles entries and lines but not for teaching angled casts. After swim by I usually work on some really easy pattern blind with some whistle stops in them. Then I will set up a 3 pole blind. Three pattern blinds with a short swim and maybe 30-40 yards total with a 10-15 yards swim. Equal length and about 10-15 yards apart. Make sure the piles are well marked, I like to use something white like a Clorox jug on a stake. First mark then line each one. Then when confident send to the middle, do a whistle stop in the water and give a angle back but a big angle. You are going to use contrition to get him to one of the side marks. Then line the middle mark. Then try the same angle again. You might need to use overs. After a while the dog will understand that the left angle back means pick a bumper up from the left pile. It is basically a three hand casting drill in the water. Don't put too much pressure on the dog in the water or to many whistle stops. baby steps. Also make sure the dog is doing angles on land well first. You can do this with just two piles as well but I like setting all three up, and master one at a time. Also wait until the water is warm. If it goes really bad just throw a bumper to the pile.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nate_C View Post
    If I understand you you are not talking about angled entries but angle casts right? Tune up drill is great for working on angles entries and lines but not for teaching angled casts. After swim by I usually work on some really easy pattern blind with some whistle stops in them. Then I will set up a 3 pole blind. Three pattern blinds with a short swim and maybe 30-40 yards total with a 10-15 yards swim. Equal length and about 10-15 yards apart. Make sure the piles are well marked, I like to use something white like a Clorox jug on a stake. First mark then line each one. Then when confident send to the middle, do a whistle stop in the water and give a angle back but a big angle. You are going to use contrition to get him to one of the side marks. Then line the middle mark. Then try the same angle again. You might need to use overs. After a while the dog will understand that the left angle back means pick a bumper up from the left pile. It is basically a three hand casting drill in the water. Don't put too much pressure on the dog in the water or to many whistle stops. baby steps. Also make sure the dog is doing angles on land well first. You can do this with just two piles as well but I like setting all three up, and master one at a time. Also wait until the water is warm. If it goes really bad just throw a bumper to the pile.
    I beg to differ... Once the dog is lining the piles,,, it would behoove someone trying to get mileage out of this drill to cast to different piles and to cast out of the water at different locations on the return.

    Angie

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    Senior Member Nate_C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angie B View Post
    I beg to differ... Once the dog is lining the piles,,, it would behoove someone trying to get mileage out of this drill to cast to different piles and to cast out of the water at different locations on the return.

    Angie
    I don't follow, how are you going to teach a dog what you expect in the water when you give an angle cast? A tune up drill is just a bunch of cold blinds. If the dog isn't literal casting in the water you are not going to get much success in a tune up drill. Doing this with an established pattern with three pile or two ...ect... helps the dog figure out what you are asking. This concept can be done a bunch of different ways but the concept is the same. This isn't a drill that I do a lot and it isn't something you have to complete like swim-by. It complements.

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    I've got to Thank Felony for this... Here's a good reference Nate.

    From Lardy's manual:
    Tune-Up Drill
    "This is a technical drill that is repeated. Tune-ups are designed to repeat concepts without repeating the same blind in a given session."
    I work a 4-7 leg tuneup drill for a week, maybe more, twice a year with the whole truck. It really gets a nice handling/lining dog on water. Once they're lining effectively, I stop and cast to the different piles. I'll also incoporate a swimby here and there while doing this drill. A person gets huge mileage out of this drill if done this way. Rorem showed this to me...

    It helps to train with a pro every now and then. Helps to get your barings straight.

    Angie

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    Senior Member Nate_C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angie B View Post
    I've got to Thank Felony for this... Here's a good reference Nate.



    I work a 4-7 leg tuneup drill for a week, maybe more, twice a year with the whole truck. It really gets a nice handling/lining dog on water. Once they're lining effectively, I stop and cast to the different piles. I'll also incoporate a swimby here and there while doing this drill. A person gets huge mileage out of this drill if done this way. Rorem showed this to me...

    It helps to train with a pro every now and then. Helps to get your barings straight.

    Angie
    I understand what a tune up drill is. But if you are running a tune up drill with identified or learned piles isn't that exactly what I was doing you are just doing it with 4-7 piles rather then 3. The only difference is that I am not mixing any other concepts in there. If you have a young dog that is not handling well in the water you certainly don't want to add in reentries, angle entries.... etc... So sure set up a very simple 4-7 leg tune up drill identify the piles, teach the piles then cast off the piles at angles. Same thing.

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    I give up... I don't think you really know what you're talking about,,, or understanding what I'm trying to tell you. See your previous posts...

    Good luck with your angle casts on water.... I'm sure there is someone out there that can help you..

    I have to ask myself sometimes,,, and "why do I waste my time answering these posts?"

    Angie

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