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Thread: Here It Comes. Hide Your Guns!

  1. #31
    Senior Member zeus3925's Avatar
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  2. #32
    Senior Member HPL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    I saw this on Morning Joe this morning. It is EXACTLY what I was referring to in my OP in the school shooting thread.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036789/..._joe/#50222624

    This video almost deserves it's own thread...
    Everyone realize that that was just a bunch of platitudes? No mention AT ALL of ANY solution, just a lot of hand wringing. What an ass.
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  3. #33
    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    I look at the gun debate a little differently...IMO its NOT a Republican vs Dem issue...yes there are Dems like Feinstein and Durbin leading the charge, but its a pro gun vs anti gun mentality out there....I watch Fox (which is not surprising to anyone) but almost to a person, I have not heard ONE on air personality come to the defense of those of us who are so staunch pro gun holders...I realize its an emotional subject right now, during church yesterday the pastor asked all in the congregation to stand and hold hands as we as a church prayed for the kids,teachers,and administrators who lost their lives, Dana and I both had tears in our eyes and were silent the rest of the sermon...

    Anyhow IMO there are many people out there that have an anti gun view due to the fact that they have never been exposed to guns in a safe and sensible manner...I am still shocked at the number of FT and dog trainers that have never handled a shotgun, I wonder what they use when it comes to shooting pigeons in training...not saying that everyone needs to be a crack shot with a shotgun but if you want to train retrievers, how can you not at least be familiar with handling a shotgun....a handgun is a whole different thing, but then who has never used a blank gun?
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  4. #34
    Member Jswann's Avatar
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    This sums it all up:

    On Friday in Connecticut, more than two dozen, mostly children, were gunned down in an act of evil.
    I once read an account that young men killed on the beaches of Normandy, as they lay dying, called out for their mothers. I tear up at even the glancing thought of the cries of the children in Connecticut and dare not take the mental walk down that road.
    Children cry out for their mommy and their daddy. Young men on the battlefield, as death comes over them, do the same. It is a natural instinct at life’s end for the young. Just the thought of the children crying out for their moms and dads as they died overwhelms the senses of those of us far removed from the tragedy. It is an instinct, though, that we should confront.
    Instead, two days removed from the horror of Friday, we are beginning again the debate and confrontations about gun control. It is a debate worth having and, whether we want to or not, we will have it. Much, if any, of what will be proposed would not have stopped the massacre.
    But though the proposals that will soon be most seriously considered would most likely not have prevented what happened, men and women of goodwill — and most are — will make the proposals because it lets them feel in control. People want to do something. People, acting corporately, want to legislate and regulate because it is, next to election of leaders, the most powerful act of a democracy.
    The efforts, even if they are successful, will not stop this cycle of violence.
    Discussions of gun control are easier to have than discussions about mental health. But they too are easier to have than those about the collapse of the American family. History and multiple studies show that the most stable foundation of a society is a two parent nuclear household with multiple children.
    In the past year we have talked more and more about the rise of singles in this country, following the rise of single parents. Because much of the question of what it means to be single involves the discussion of choices, we cannot have a conversation about the nuclear family. The only conclusion that would benefit our society would be a conclusion that renders too many of the choices made by twenty and thirty somethings in our society today invalid.
    Unless our culture shifts back toward recognizing the need for stable families with multiple children, the situation will only get worse. Coupled with that comes difficult conversations about equality and the roles young men in society must grow up to fit into. None of these horrific incidents have been committed by girls or women, but by disturbed young men — some, to be sure, in the very nuclear families most likely to help reduce these senseless acts. Nuclear families will not cure the problem and, in fact, mass incidents like this have declined over time though the 6 worst school shootings have been in the past decade. But we look at the tragedy in Connecticut and ignore the daily killings and life destroying acts across the nation. We focus on Connecticut, but not inner-cities or impoverished communities of broken homes.
    When pointing out that two parent households of multiple children provide the greatest stability in a society, many deny the fact. Many demand data or more studies then try to discredit the studies. It says more about the denial of responsibility for the choices the deniers have made than it does about the studies or the facts. This is, however, why we will not change. But as government tries to spread its caring hands even further and replace or supplement the need for family, no child will ever in terror cry out for Uncle Sam, just for mom or dad.
    Turning its back on the nuclear family, our society has concurrently turned its back on discussing evil. Evil, like God, is mythology to many in our country even when confronted with it at the barrel of a gun.
    We have become accustomed in our vernacular to treat evil as the opposite of good or the opposite of God. Evil is not just a word and not the opposite of good or God, but the absence of God taking on a life of its own. The act in Connecticut may have been committed by a mentally disturbed individual, but the act was evil. The person, at the time committing the act, was evil.
    God and good exist. The devil and evil do as well — the incarnation of the absolute void left in the absence of God.
    Colossians 1:15 states, ‘[Christ] is before all things, and in him all things hold together.” As our society drifts further and further from Christ, our society holds itself together less and less. The rise of secularism coincides with the decline of family and the rise of societal chaos.
    In our society, it is impolite to say this. Many who reject this mock Christians. They wonder why God or Jesus were not in that school room protecting those children. Liberal gay-rights activist Dan Savage on Friday was openly ridiculing Christians and mocking God. Liberal pundits were retweeting him.
    They choose not to understand. They have chosen the very society that generates the heinous act we saw on Friday — a society replacing ourselves and our standards with those of God. It is a society St. Paul described quite accurately in Romans 1.
    For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. . . . They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator . . . . Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done. They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; they have no understanding, no fidelity, no love, no mercy.
    Romans 1:21, 25, 28-31
    On Friday in Connecticut, an evil creature entered a classroom and gunned down children in our ever increasing Romans 1 society.
    At this Christmas season we should remember the part of the Christmas story we often do not dwell on. Two thousand years ago, King Herod sent his soldiers to Bethlehem where they slaughtered all the boys age 2 and under. The coming of the Risen Lord was answered by this world with the loss of the innocents.
    The world is full of sin. It is easy for the non-Christian to look at what happened and rationalize away that the person was mentally ill, we need gun control, etc. It is harder, especially at this time of year, for those who do believe in God to find comfort in him instead of demanding “why?” But God does not spare us the effects of sin in the world, nor does he spare the little children.
    But we know by faith that “Jesus wept.” He weeps now. He welcomes home the little children and calls for us to persevere and, if we will, to turn back toward him and bring our society with us. But our society must be prepared to have larger conversations than whether or not we should regulate guns or bullets.
    Then pealed the bells more loud and deep:
    “God is not dead, nor doth He sleep;
    The Wrong shall fail,
    The Right prevail,
    With peace on earth, good-will to men.”


    Written by Erick Erickson

  5. #35
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    To me, a comprehensive Gun/Hunter safety course taught in middle school would address some of the issues.

    I mean if it "saved 1 childs life" it would be beneficial, correct??

    Some of the strongest gun legislation in the USA is in Chicago, IL.
    Anyone got any stats or graphs on firearm related deaths there?

    Aren't we always being told by the incremental secular progressives that education is the key to a better society?
    If firearms are a part of society, then people should be educated about them.

    The disinformation being spewed by the likes of Schulz and Maddow is insane.

    Again, I ask, when did a .223 caliber become "Hi-Powered?"

    If I wanted hi-powered rifle I'm thinking a BAR or a .300 Weatherby.

    I gauruntee you, the ISP will get something out of this in their quest to disarm the citizenry!!

    We will never get it back.

    Increment by increment, they keep chipping away.
    The fight is never over................
    Stan b & Elvis

  6. #36
    Senior Member Buzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HPL View Post
    Everyone realize that that was just a bunch of platitudes? No mention AT ALL of ANY solution, just a lot of hand wringing. What an ass.
    What I heard was death of the influence of the gun lobby, even with a conservative libertarian like Scarborough. I know that I'm about to hear that Scarborough isn't a conservative, but I realize that it takes a real nut case to be considered conservative these days.

    This is exactly what I was predicting in my post on Friday...
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  7. #37
    Senior Member Quackwacker's Avatar
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    This makes a lot of sense......................

    http://www.policeone.com/active-shoo...emy-is-denial/

  8. #38
    Senior Member cotts135's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nate_C View Post
    OK so I am about to get killed on this board but some of the points they are making are fair about gun control. No guns didn't cause these events but they make them more deadly. On the flip side The problem is that progressives in this country want to take all the guns not just the extremely dangerous ones so many on the guns rights sides have to reject all gun legislation which is fair but what if we both got something.

    1. Lets allow a total ban on some of the more dangerous guns that present the greatest danger. Some of these weapons like the AR and AK with high capacity clips and fairly easy to make fully automatic.
    2. Ban high capacity clips say over 10 rounds
    3. Prevent large gun purchases. When a 23 year old comes into a southern state wanting to buy 10 handguns at the same time he is up to no good. I heard of one law that you can only by 1 gun every 30 days. I would be OK with that for handguns.
    4. Some sort of waiting period and restrictions on hand guns

    But in return I would want a federal gun owners rights portion that reestablishes gun owners rights, and that would eliminate some of the over barring local laws. And some sort of ban on new legislation against guns.
    I agree with everything you said. I would add though that there needs to be strong effort in some way to keep guns from people who shouldn't have them. This might involve some very difficult privacy issues such as access to medical records.
    The big thing is that something gets worked out that prevents these senseless killings in the future. And the time to talk about it is now.

  9. #39
    Senior Member jacduck's Avatar
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    I have a new thought for me on gun control. Anyone like Mayor gloomburger who has body guards and police escorts should demand they be unarmed immediately to point the way for me not needing self protection at home or in the streets of NY or Boston. Outlaw bodyguards carrying for celebrities and political persons like Rosie O D who has armed guards for her children. If I can't have a gun or even many guns to hell with them. Oh yeah make it against the law for criminals to use guns.
    John C aka jacduck


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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nate_C View Post
    1. Lets allow a total ban on some of the more dangerous guns that present the greatest danger. Some of these weapons like the AR and AK with high capacity clips and fairly easy to make fully automatic.
    2. Ban high capacity clips say over 10 rounds
    3. Prevent large gun purchases. When a 23 year old comes into a southern state wanting to buy 10 handguns at the same time he is up to no good. I heard of one law that you can only by 1 gun every 30 days. I would be OK with that for handguns.
    4. Some sort of waiting period and restrictions on hand guns

    But in return I would want a federal gun owners rights portion that reestablishes gun owners rights, and that would eliminate some of the over barring local laws. And some sort of ban on new legislation against guns.
    If #1 is a primary motivator, PLEASE watch this somewhat older video. Some of it may be too basic, but please watch it to the end where the ATF and police officers are testifying.


    They are no different than any semiauto that accepts mags. They are as easy as any other semi auto to make full auto.

    And the testimony says there are NONE that they have came across that have been made full auto.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yATeti5GmI8
    Last edited by dixidawg; 12-17-2012 at 02:39 PM.

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