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Thread: Line manners question during launching of marks

  1. #1
    Senior Member Wayne Nutt's Avatar
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    Default Line manners question during launching of marks

    What do you try to achieve when the dog is on the line?

    1. Sitting calmly and just moving his head as the marks get launched.
    2. Keeping his butt on the ground/mat but moving his front in the direction of the marks as launched.

    With my Rowdy I am trying for no. 1. Is there any advantage/disadvantage to this? All my past dogs have been no. 2, so this is new to me. But Rowdy seems to be a lot calmer on the line than any previous dog I have trained.
    Last edited by Wayne Nutt; 12-29-2012 at 08:07 AM.
    Wayne Nutt
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  2. #2
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    Wayne a few years ago I was fortunate enough to be at a training session that Ken Niel attended (the man's accomplishments as an amature speak for themselves).
    One thing that stuck out to me with all the dogs he took off the truck was near perfect manners from the box, to the holding blind to the line and back to the box.

    I have no doubt in my mind that this level of line manners helps the dog tremendously when it comes to concentrating on his marks. #1 is a good goal IMO.

    Bert
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  3. #3
    Senior Member Evan's Avatar
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    Wayne,

    The late Jim Kappes stated it this way. "Each dog has its own style (online)." He was referring to how much movement a dog may be allowed, while conforming to a high steadiness standard. It's unfair to treat each one as a clone of the other, so some dogs will do better overall if they have latitude to move a bit, as long as it's not forward.

    "Lucy" (FC-AFC Trumarc's Too Hot to Handle) was a great No.1 dog. She sat stright up like a statue in a neutral position, and exploded when sent. "Bart" (FC-AFC Blackwater Bart II) had a different individual style that really worked better for him. He rocked up and down as the birds fell. Anyone who watched him can tell you how he marked! It's dog to dog.

    But the chief criteria for me is this: If experience tells you a certain dog needs to move a bit, fine - as long as it's not forward.

    Evan
    "Prepare your dog in such a manner that the work he is normally called upon to do under-whelms him, not overwhelms him." ~ Evan Graham

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  4. #4
    Senior Member Sundown49 aka Otey B's Avatar
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    I have had both. My Maxx was a number 2. He would get lower in the front as marks went down. My Boss dog sits like a statue and his head moves. MUCH prefer Boss over Maxx.
    My Dad said to me ."Son, a man just needs three things to be happy....A good dog, a good gun and a good wife.....Thank God I have all three
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  5. #5
    Senior Member MooseGooser's Avatar
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    I want #1.

    I think it makes more sense to make "sit" very black and white..

    Allowing any movement after a "sit" I believe ,,is counter productive..

    My previous bad habits are very hard to break, but working on them.

    Gooser
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  6. #6
    Senior Member Breck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Nutt View Post
    What do you try to achieve when the dog is on the line? Both

    1. Sitting calmly and just moving his head as the marks get launched.
    Yes, but He should stay locked on and looking at last fall until YOU Que him otherwise. You do not want dog taking control or thinking he can look where or when he wants.

    2. Keeping his butt on the ground/mat but moving his front in the direction of the marks as launched.
    Yes also, BUT he should only move his front if YOU move or pivot to line him up to another bird. In doing so he MUST NOT violate Sit. That is even though he moves his front his butt stays in contact with the ground. Practice this doing 360 degree heel and here with dog in heel sit position. Your criteria for correcting would be if his nads come off the ground.
    ..........
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  7. #7
    Senior Member Mary Lynn Metras's Avatar
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    Sitting and watching the birds as they fall. I keep my eye on the dog as the marks are going down. No movement. If I don't like; I stop and correct right away (head swinging, creeping).

    I used to say "mark" "sit" in HRC. Now I have to learn to keep quiet until last bird down and the Judge calls dog or your number!! Teach him to sit and you don't have to say anything.
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