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Thread: URGENT: AVMA to vote 'AGAINST' using Homeopathic Therapy in treating pets, JAN. 5

  1. #21
    Senior Member mitty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swack View Post
    bbgator,

    I have known many people who swear by the theory "like cures like" after a night of excess. I think they referred to it as "Hair of the Dog"!

    However, I will admit that I didn't understand what "Homeopathy" was when I wrote my first post on this thread. Thanks to you and mitty I have done a little research and am now better informed.

    However, the light of this new knowledge doesn't change the message of my post. I do think much of the "conventional wisdom" we are fed by the media on behalf of special interest groups including Big Pharma and Big Agri and others too numerous to name can be mis-leading and/or incorrect. We need to be vigilant and protect our rights to make our own informed decisions.

    Thanks for helping to inform us!

    Swack
    That works for alcohol withdrawal symptoms.
    Renee P

  2. #22
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    a substance that causes the symptoms of a disease in healthy people will cure similar symptoms in sick people. Scientific research has found homeopathic remedies ineffective and their postulated mechanisms of action implausible. Within the medical community homeopathy is considered to be quackery.
    They think the same way about chiropractors.
    years ago all of the doctors pain killers and recommendations and warnings about having quacks work on my back,,,,, couldn't get me on my feet after 2 weeks in bed. Someone told me about chiropractors I gave them a try. I was hauled in to see one in a wheel barrow,(figurative) A half hour later I was out the door and back to work and doing cart wheels. The medical community doesn't know as much as they should. I don't trust a whole lot of what they or the government have to say about much.

    Pete
    John 5 :30
    I can of my own self do nothing ,as I hear , I judge,,and my judgement is just, because I seek not my own will,,but the will of the father which hath sent me
    John 7:16 -- Jesus answered them and said my doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
    mark 16:9 -- So then after the lord had spoken unto them,he was received up in heaven, and sat on the right hand of God
    I Tim. 2:5 --For there is one God and one mediator between God and man ,, the man Christ Jesus

  3. #23
    Senior Member mitty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TBell View Post
    Clinical management of babesiosis in dogs with homeopathic Crotalus horridus 200C.

    Chaudhuri S, Varshney JP.
    Source

    Clinical Diagnosis laboratory, Referral Veterinary Polyclinic, Indian Veterinary Research Institute, Izatnagar 243122 UP, India. drshubhamitra@gmail.com

    Abstract

    Homeopathic Crotalus horridus 200C was evaluated in 13 clinical cases of babesiosis in dogs, compared with another 20 clinical cases treated with diminazine. Babesiosis is an important tropical tick-borne haemoprotozoan disease in dogs clinically manifested by anorexia, dehydration, temperature, dullness/depression, diarrhoea/constipation, pale mucosa, hepatomegaly, vomiting/nausea, splenomegaly, distended abdomen/ascites, yellow coloured urine, emaciation/weight loss, and occular discharge. The diagnosis of babesiosis was based on cytological evidence of Babesia gibsoni in freshly prepared blood smears. The dogs were treated with oral C. horridus 200C, 4 pills four times daily for 14 days (n=13) or diminazine aceturate 5 mg/kg single intramuscularly dose (n=20). All the dogs were administered 5% Dextrose normal saline at 60 ml/kg intravenously for 4 days. Initial clinical scores were similar in both groups and showed similar progressive improvement with the two treatments over 14 days. Parasitaemia also improved in both groups, but haematological values showed no change. No untoward reactions were observed. It appears that C. horridus is as effective in causing clinical recovery in moderate cases of canine babesiosis caused by Babesia gibsoni as the standard drug diminazine. Large scale randomized trials are indicated for more conclusive results.

    As the AHVMA states in its response to the AVMA, "The Case against Homeopathy contains many unsubstantiated allegations..........then as practitioners of conventional medication, we would find ourselves working with a significantly limited selection of therapeutic options."
    For some reason I decided to read this paper. There is no evidence the Crotalus horridus 200C or the other drug did anything, they did not have a placebo group.

    What is Crotalus horridus 200C? Rattle snake? Really?
    Renee P

  4. #24

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    [QUOTE=TBell;1051351]Clinical management of babesiosis in dogs with homeopathic Crotalus horridus 200C.

    This piece of research is typical of those cited as demonstrating the efficacy of homeopathy in that it has serious methodological flaws. In this particular research, there wasn't even a control group! That's not just a serious flaw...it's a fatal flaw.

    There have been many studies of the efficacy of homeopathy. The best that can be found is a placebo effect.

    If you're not familiar with the placebo effect, you can read about that here:
    http://www.skepdic.com/placebo.html

    Is there a placebo effect for animals?
    http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/...t-for-animals/

    A good writeup on homeopathy is here:
    http://www.quackwatch.org/01Quackery...ics/homeo.html

    Here are a couple points made in the AVMA white paper on homeopathy, which accompanies the proposed resolution:
    "Because it is unethical to offer ineffective therapies to clients, and dangerous to substitute a placebo therapy for truly effective medicine, there is a movement towards publicly acknowledging that there is no reason to believe homeopathic treatment has any real value in preventing or treating disease."

    "In veterinary medicine, our clients can only have real choice, and justified faith in their veterinarians, if we are willing to be clear and honest in informing them when practices, such as homeopathy, are shown to be ineffective."

  5. #25
    Senior Member mitty's Avatar
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    My guess is that the dogs in the study improved because their own immune systems were fighting off the pathogen.

    Too bad they didn't include a 3rd group of dogs that received NO treatment, then we could tell.
    Renee P

  6. #26
    Senior Member Steve Shaver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    They think the same way about chiropractors.
    years ago all of the doctors pain killers and recommendations and warnings about having quacks work on my back,,,,, couldn't get me on my feet after 2 weeks in bed. Someone told me about chiropractors I gave them a try. I was hauled in to see one in a wheel barrow,(figurative) A half hour later I was out the door and back to work and doing cart wheels. The medical community doesn't know as much as they should. I don't trust a whole lot of what they or the government have to say about much.

    Pete




    I was told to live with my back pain. Dr told me spinal manipulation (chiropractor) might help. After 4 sessions had to quit due to more pain in other places that didnt hurt when I started.

  7. #27
    Senior Member Swack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mitty View Post
    That works for alcohol withdrawal symptoms.
    mitty,

    I don't think they were treating the symptoms of alcohol withdrawal. I think it was a hang-over!

    BTW, I don't typically use emoticons, so you had to read the "tongue-in-check" nature of my comment for yourself. Sorry if you couldn't read the grin on my face.


    Swack
    Jeff Swackhamer

  8. #28
    Senior Member mitty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swack View Post
    mitty,

    I don't think they were treating the symptoms of alcohol withdrawal. I think it was a hang-over!

    BTW, I don't typically use emoticons, so you had to read the "tongue-in-check" nature of my comment for yourself. Sorry if you couldn't read the grin on my face.


    Swack
    No I got that you were joking but was sort of on point, no? I should have added my own emoticons!

    Somewhere I read that the basic hangover is partly caused by alcohol withdrawal and that is why drinking more alcohol relieves it...but I have no idea if this is true.
    Renee P

  9. #29
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    I don't mean to change the direction of this thread but how many people actually feed their dogs raw meat as a regular diet?

  10. #30
    Senior Member frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuddyJ View Post
    I don't mean to change the direction of this thread but how many people actually feed their dogs raw meat as a regular diet?
    Subject has been discussed a few times before..here's one thread using "search feature"
    http://www.retrievertraining.net/for...light=RAW+diet
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