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Pesky Neighbors Don't Like My Dog Training

14K views 62 replies 52 participants last post by  SFKennels 
#1 ·
Decided to do walking collar fetch in the front driveway today and had to ear pinch on a couple refusals. Same neighbor that told me I was cruel to my dogs for leaving them outside in kennels during the day on a past occasion decided to come over and tell me how cruel I was being to that poor little puppy. She went on to say that that metal collar on his neck is cruel and how would I like to be jerked around by that? She also mentioned calling animal cruelty and taking photos to show them. Her final comment was that dogs have feelings just like humans and if I did not love them then I shouldn't have dogs.

I did my best to stay calm and explain that sometimes the training may not always look pleasant but is necessary for the training program and both her and her husband have also complimented me on what well trained dogs I have.

Obviously I will not be training in the front of the house anymore where she can make observations but was wondering how some others might deal with this situation. Would be interested to hear what others who have experienced similar situations have done to deal with this stuff in a professional manner. What do you tell animal cruelty if they do show up?
 
#32 ·
Sometimes we need to look at things through another persons eyes. While we know exactly what your doing Ersa that has been programmed by those disgusting add campaigns sees it differently.

Before you all crucify me think about it. Sometimes discretion is the better part of valor..........find another spot and let Ersa get some puppy kisses from your happy dawg.

Of course Ersa is a figment of my imagination....
 
#33 ·
Twenty nine years ago I bought 80 acres 7 1/2 miles out side of a small town. Before I signed the papers, I went to my -to be- next door neighbor who lived about 125 yds. East of where I planned to build a 21 run kennel (you can never have too much room) and asked her if she objected about dogs barking, since that"s what kenneled dogs often do. She said that she liked to hear them bark, that she didn't feel so alone. (She was 80 years old, widowed, and still raised a herd of cows.) The only complaint I ever heard was, "Bill, would you climb over the fence and see if you can see my red cow, she is due to calve, and I haven't seen her today?" The only time I ever had a problem was when I was awakened at 2 AM by a shot gun shot, followed by two more. She called the next morning to tell me it was her that shot. It seems that a young AA came to her door and said, "Lady, I got trouble". She shoved the end of the shot gun thru the chained door and said," Fellow, you don't know what trouble is," and with that she fired again as he jumped the front gate. She put another shot after in case he decided to stop by Cleo and Bill's house. She was a great neighbor for years and those that have moved here since she died, know that they have moved next to a kennel through their own choice and we have had no comments.

The local game wardens know we train dogs and the only time they have come on the place was when we called them to help get some deer hunters gather up their dogs from our property. Strange dogs or strange people are not welcome on breeding kennel property. Cleo is Parvo paranoid, and you don't want to run into a paranoid Cleo, don't ask hoe I know. Bill
 
#34 ·
I haven't read all the posts , but you are BEGGING for trouble in today's society with an ear pinch , prong collar , etc.... A vocal dog sounds/looks great on some shmucks cell phone ... Its called EVIDENCE in a courtroom.........Better safe than sorry regards..........
 
#35 ·
I live in town and have done ob/FF/CC work in my back yard, down the alley way at my old house and now in a dead end street at my new house. I have always been very cautious about doing this. I have taken a proactive approach and it has worked for me. I have taken my closest neighbors and let them know I train dogs and that sometimes it appears the dog is not enjoying things so much. You may see them bite,squal, etc. You may see me pull on their toes, their ears and use various pieces of equipment you are not familiar with. I encourage them to watch and ask questions if they like. Most don't pay attention and go about their lives. I've had a couple come out periodically and watch. Knock on wood I've had no bad encounters. I think part of the reason for this is my dogs always look happy and enjoy being with me, even after a FF session. secondly it is important to be in control. A onlooker should be able to tell a difference from a out of control person taking aggression out on a dog versus a "good dog" extra loud so if anyone is watching they can hear my positive response to the dog.

With that said, I sympathize with you as I'm not so naive as to beleieve evryone has an open mind and can be educated.

Good Luck!!
 
#36 ·
What is the neighbor really like? Perhaps if you explain that all dogs, but especially working dogs need to mind unerringly for their own safety she would see that short periods of discomfort can prevent serious injury. My niece's boyfriend and his roommate had a couple of dogs that weren't trained. A couple of months ago they bolted through the open door and both got hit by a car. Boyfriend's dog seriously injured and big vet bills, roommate's dog killed. Had they had an absolute SIT, they could have been stopped before getting to the street. A tragic but excellent example of why dogs NEED to MIND.
 
#37 ·
I had the same experience when I force fetched my last dog. Neighbor came over told me he had a book on how to train dogs.

I seen the hand writing on the wall, next would have been animal control , a ticket and tell it to the judge/

I make my mind up right then and there , to force fetch away from neighbors.

These people don't have a clue but they can cause you grief in the legal system
 
#41 · (Edited)
Definitely worth a 2nd & 3rd read and should be committed to memory whenever we have our dogs out in public.

This thread reminded me of an incident I had a couple of years ago. I'd loaded up the dogs on a beautiful spring day to train, but had to run errands first. Finishing up, I stopped by a strip mall to pick up a couple things our club needed for our hunt test the next day. I parked the truck and even though it was only 72 degrees out, left it running with the AC on just in case and ran in and grabbed what I needed. While in line at the check out, I overheard the clerk talking to the woman in front of me about how the cops were there because someone had left dogs locked in a hot car. A quick glance outside revealed a delegation of uniforms and people gathering around MY truck! I ran out and some woman was shrieking about how the poor dogs were dying. I'd actually noticed her earlier since she was sitting on a bench outside the store wearing a dirty aqua house coat and smoking a cigarette. I really had to bite my tongue not to give her a piece of my mind when she screeched to the cops the dogs had been there all day and am glad I kept my cool.

One of the cops had some gizmo he pointed at my window that he said gave him a temp. reading inside the car, and it registered over 100 degrees! Now bear in mind it was only 72 degrees outside and, I had my AC on. I opened the door and politely invited the cop to take the inside temp (also 72 degrees) and resisted the urge to whisper sic-sic-sic-sic to the sleeping Chesapeakes. I also produced a dated deposit slip from the bank a few miles away where I'd been 20 minutes earlier to refute the psycho woman's claim the dogs had been there suffering for hours. Because I was the HT sec., I realized how much trouble I could be in if I got ticketed for animal cruelty even if the charges were totally bogus, and how expensive/time wasting it would be if I got charged. So even though I was furious I was polite and helpful to the cops and said nothing to the freak that called them and once things were explained to them, the cops were OK although they warned me to be careful on hot days (as if!) These days you cannot be too careful--no matter how wrong the neighbors/complainers are, it's NOT worth the trouble of stirring them up.

 
#42 ·
Get a bandana--they're useful for retriever training in public. They can be tied around prong collars and ecollars, so you look like a doting owner who'd never, ever do anything mean to your doggie.
Check out these prong collar covers. Beats a bandana.

http://www.cozycritter.com/prongcovers.htm
 
#44 ·
Its not just gun dog training. Cesar Millan is often criticized for "kicking" dogs while rehabilitating them. It seems that people are just ignorant when it comes to dogs. Most time I just walk the other way when I see someone cuing their dog like its a child. Those people are just selfish and uneducated. I don't know about you guys but I would rather see someone correct their dog rather than seeing aggressive, nervous, and frustrated dogs. I guess I'm just a barbarian ;-)
 
#45 ·
I had one of those nosey folks by my old house. To start with I was on city council and was on great terms with the police chief and prosecuting atty. That said I never did have to call in a favor thankfully. This lady was a hard core bunny hugger and she had made a comment one time about some dog training something and saw the e collar. She went in to a rant and said she was going to call blah blah. I told her go ahead and I will be calling the building inspector, DEA. children's services and the center for disease control on her and asked her if she still wanted to proceed. I then explained about how glass houses worked. Never spoke another word.. I am sure most people dont want the attn of the "man" directed to themselves either.
 
#46 · (Edited)
I believe this is exactly the right approach! Just yeilding to these people only gives them more power. There are very few people without dirt. Find out what it is and use it against them and your problem is likely to go away without getting any law enforcement involved. You have to stand up for yourself people, even if it is a little inconvenient and uncomfortable!!
 
#49 ·
when i had a litter of pups on the ground and it was time to introduce pigeons at 7 weeks it went well with all very birdy so we left 2 friends playing with the pups and we went and trained their parents when we got home there was a message to call the police so I did and the officer said some women had called concerned about the welfare of the birds , he then said he had gone in the back yard and checked the pups (gates were locked) and then I went off on him and I asked him if I broke an laws? his comment was I could site you for disturbing the peace. Well
I had his captain called who I have known for 30 yrs and asked if he wanted me to call 911 every time I saw a squirrel hit by a car or a rabbit he said I wish you wouldn't and he said he would have a talk to the officer no problems since
David Jansma
 
#50 ·
My husband and I stopped at the grocery store after our 9 to 5 job on a hot hot day, the girls go to work with us every day (when not in training) and were in the truck with air running. we went into the store for 15 minutes, power shopped and came out, walking to the truck - we ran into a complainer.... Well, the truck has the logo and name of our 9-5 job on the doors. So, the complainer states "-businees name- must have so much money they can leave the vehicle running!" My husband enjoyed his reply of... with more 'decorated' words added... "there are dogs in the truck!" The old complainer looked up at the truck to see the girls wagging their tails - awaiting our arrival! the old crabber shut up, lowered his head, and walked away... feeling like a heel!

so what ever you do... you won't be right in some ones eyes, be right in yours and your dogs eyes! and don't ff in front of people who don't have a clue, but don't it stop ff!and make sure you have the first complaint to the police!

the owners, trainers, vets, ect understand that these dogs are atheletes - which most of the owners, trainers, vets ect (& neiborbors) could not do half of what these great dogs do! training for any athlete is hard work! and anyone who does not understand that they are grand - are uneducated and misguided.
 
#51 ·
Your in Il imagine what we deal with CA.
 
#53 ·
I groom dogs as a side-job and have a little grooming shop set up in the garage. 95% of my little charges are angels and quite used to the grooming routine. The other 5% are screaming, thrashing, biting idiots. As you might imagine, trying to restrain one of these little beauties to administer their grooming is not a walk in the park. First thing I do when it becomes apparent that we have a problem, I shut the garage door. I really don't need my neighbors seeing me wrestle down a screaming bichon who's trying to bite my face off.
I do train my own dogs in the front yard or street in front of my house all the time. My neighbors think I'm nuts but generally they quite enjoy seeing me work the dogs. (Then again, if I regularly found myself in training scenarios that would make my neighbors question animal abuse, I think I'd change training techniques...) One time the neighbor's kid came over while I was out in the yard, and said "Scuse me I wanted to know if I could pet Fisher but I couldn't tell if you were training or playing." That was a compliment :)
 
#54 ·
Be careful with the neighbors. Just in September I went on vacation for a week and had my neighbor feed my dogs which was great until a nosey neighbor beside me thought my dogs where being mistreated so she was sneaking in my back gate feeding them good knows what. Make a long story short my HRCH died at 5 with pancretitis from the food she was feeding her 2 weeks later. Didn't get sorry or nothing. People should mind there own dang business.
 
#57 ·
I think this entire discussion points out why I have never lived in a traditional neighborhood since the first few months of marriage! Even if it weren't for the dogs, I prefer to be master of my own domain to the largest extent possible. I may have just been darn lucky, but I have never encountered anyone that really got upset with my training or having dogs in my truck. I do take the time to introduce my dogs to anybody that shows an interest in what we are doing. They always ask about the e collar, but when I explain using the "safety first" approach, somehow I've never had a problem. I do believe a lot of it is just luck, not running into any nutcases. But I also think it helps to have an open, approachable attitude. Oh yeah, it also helps to have a chessie.
 
#58 · (Edited)
You are of course correct that it is your right to do anything you want on your property that is not illegal or otherwise prohibited (i. e., subdivision covenants). However, just because you have the right to do something does not mean it is smart to exercise that right in a given situation.

First, are you sure you know exactly who you are dealing with? I am talking about people who have connections as well as people who may be mentally ill or maybe just plain mean. If you keep your dogs outside where people can get access to them, this is a thought. If you offend someone into harming your dogs, is it going to matter very much whether you had the right to do whatever it was that they chose to take offense to?

Second, we all need to realize that there are some parts of dog training that are not pleasant to watch or participate in either for the dog or the trainer - and that's knowing what we are doing and why. Imagine what FF looks like to the uninitiated. You would think someone would ask before they called the cops, etc., but we all know that's not necessarily the case.

It's always good to be strategic. I have a neighbor who just turns his dog out into the neighborhood to relieve himself. Never mind the fact that we live on the access road for several neighborhoods and I have seen this dog get that close to death countless times, I don't want another male dog coming into my yard unannounced or just have him crap all over it. Rather that try to force the issue, I simply walked over there one day and let them know that my dog was fighting Giardia (which was even true), and that I wanted to let them know that their dog might be in danger of getting it if it came into our yard. For the most part, problem solved, and they likely think I did them a favor.

You are of course free to exercise your rights, and we all know that there are some people out there who just can't stay out of your business and who force you to insist on your rights. Others have given the advice to make sure you make the first calls to law enforcement, and I wholeheartedly agree. If you can frame the issue initially you stand a much better chance of success.

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but I have a real problem with allowing a neighbor to decide what I can and cannot do on my own property so long as 1) it is not illegal (and I've got a fairly good grasp on that concept); 2) it is not harmful to their property, health, or welfare; 3) it is not a nuisance or other activity that affects that neighbor directly.

An example: when I was a teen, we lived in a town where the supermajority of residents were Christian Reformed. It was their belief that you should not mow your lawn, wash your car, paint your house, etc, on a Sunday. We were not of the same church being Lutheran. We did not share those beliefs.

On many occasions some neighbors would complain that the grass was being cut, or a car being washed in the middle of the day on a Sunday. My dad politely explained to them where the property line was, and how it was intended to be used. One called the cops because we were "disturbing the peace" with the lawnmower. The officer explained how calling 911 for the wrong reason was a crime, and asked if the person wanted to re-think the complaint.

Allowing others, without due process of law, to dictate what you can do on your own land is how rights get eroded. First it is courtesy, then it becomes expected, then unwritten policy, and soon some schmuck proposes it as an ordinance at a township meeting.

Rant over.
 
#59 · (Edited)
Obviously I will not be training in the front of the house anymore where she can make observations but was wondering how some others might deal with this situation. Would be interested to hear what others who have experienced similar situations have done to deal with this stuff in a professional manner. What do you tell animal cruelty if they do show up?
Well I think you should start a new training regime .... for the neighbour.

Look at it this way, if you had a dog that didn't understand the concept you were teaching and gave a poor response you'd take the SOP of going back, simplifying, make it easier to grasp, and rewarding it for good performance. Substitute "neighbour" for "dog" and there is your way forward. All of those who have offered "aversive" methods are undoubtedly sincere, but in my opinion misguided. No one wants a falling out with the neighbours, life's too short for that stuff, and just being aggressive is a certain recipe for a downhill progression where what you want is the exact reverse. Being from UK I don't fully understand the implications of "animal cruelty" being involved, but it doesn't sound too good and needs to be taken seriously.

So if it was me, I'd approach the lady say I was sorry we'd got our wires crossed and offer her to stand in to a training session for half an hour; that I took the implied threats about cruelty very seriously, and so should she. If she agrees, take the collar and place it on your own arm. If that goes all right (and you don't need to be de-bolted :D ) go through some simple drills offering her the chance to take part. If she doesn't want to play, prepare to either beat her to the punch with the cruelty guys, and /or have a spiel in mind if they do turn up. I've no doubt there is some statutory brief they work to; find out what it is and devise verbal responses and practical demonstrations to counter it.

Eug
 
#60 ·
I have first hand knowledge of an individual in a similar situation. The authority that permitted the facility and animal control inspected the kennel and found know problems. However a few minutes of selectively recorded video resulted in arrest and charges. After 5-8K in attorney fees a plea was reached. Don't underestimate a nosy neighbor or an aggresive DA. Discretion is the better part of valor.
 
#62 ·
Win or loose your case if it gets to that, we all dog owners and trainers, loose on this one. That and the fact if you do go to court, all these e-mails will be evidence.........My opinion, getting into a match with the neighbor is a loose, loose situtation, even if you are right. Duckdon
 
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