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Thread: Young dog marking drills/concepts

  1. #31
    Senior Member Mark Chase's Avatar
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    Yeah, it is a little bit of a dilema when you are setting up training scenarios and you happen to have Grady running the scenario. He seems to make everything look a lot easier than it is for the other dogs. A special animal indeed!!!
    Take a Kid Hunting and create a memory that will last a lifetime!

  2. #32
    Senior Member savage25xtreme's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cakaiser View Post
    I don't think that is a good thing to do with a pup. It's more for an older dog, that has issues running tight to guns/fall areas. You don't want to possibly get the pup to think, ok to go back to old fall. Fall areas, at that age, should be not tight, and distinct area for each one..
    Drills like that, big white bumper, on mowed grass, don't really teach a dog to mark. Only real marks, in the field, do that.

    So, take your bumper boys to the field, and set up stickmen with them. Set up concept doubles, then run as singles. You can do long/short, for check down, or short/long, for run past old fall, don't go back.
    Continue using terrain, hills, ditches, wind, angling cover strips, etc. Singles off multiple guns, is the way to go. Even better if you can set up 3 marks.

    Throws should be as long, flat, as possible. You want the pup to focus, watch the throw for as long as possible. Angled in/ straight back, don't allow for this. Get the bumper as far from gun as you can.
    .Short throws encourage dog not to mark, just run at the gun.Teach check downs, etc, by how you set up the marks, not by the throw.

    If you like big, white bumpers in a mowed field, ok, fun for you, and the dog..But, not going to really teach much of anything. IMO
    Unless you have a dog with little drive, needs momentum. Then, like to do that kind of thing. Depends.
    I like this post, with 1 addition. If you notice hunts getting large, or little confidence in the mark. Throw a couple on mowed grass. Momentum will never be a problem with my young dog, but confidence can be. I typically set up 4 wingers with stickmen run them all as singles, plenty of terrain, cover and now getting back into the water in route....BUT I will have 2 of the marks land in wide open areas so that if the dog gets close he will pin it. The other 2 will be the same but land in thick cover. I feel it helps balance confidence in my little guy.

    Good luck, it sure is fun seeing the light turn on a little brighter every day in the young ones.
    Gavin B.

  3. #33
    Senior Member WBF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cakaiser View Post
    I don't think that is a good thing to do with a pup. It's more for an older dog, that has issues running tight to guns/fall areas. You don't want to possibly get the pup to think, ok to go back to old fall. Fall areas, at that age, should be not tight, and distinct area for each one..
    Drills like that, big white bumper, on mowed grass, don't really teach a dog to mark. Only real marks, in the field, do that.

    So, take your bumper boys to the field, and set up stickmen with them. Set up concept doubles, then run as singles. You can do long/short, for check down, or short/long, for run past old fall, don't go back.
    Continue using terrain, hills, ditches, wind, angling cover strips, etc. Singles off multiple guns, is the way to go. Even better if you can set up 3 marks.

    Throws should be as long, flat, as possible. You want the pup to focus, watch the throw for as long as possible. Angled in/ straight back, don't allow for this. Get the bumper as far from gun as you can.
    .Short throws encourage dog not to mark, just run at the gun.Teach check downs, etc, by how you set up the marks, not by the throw.

    If you like big, white bumpers in a mowed field, ok, fun for you, and the dog..But, not going to really teach much of anything. IMO
    Unless you have a dog with little drive, needs momentum. Then, like to do that kind of thing. Depends.
    This is good stuff right here. Great info Kaiser. I also don't like throwing bidirectional off a gunner, promotes hunting both sides. Keep setups black and white, keep areas of the fall black and white. Build off your singles.

  4. #34
    Senior Member cakaiser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by savage25xtreme View Post
    I like this post, with 1 addition. If you notice hunts getting large, or little confidence in the mark. Throw a couple on mowed grass. Momentum will never be a problem with my young dog, but confidence can be. I typically set up 4 wingers with stickmen run them all as singles, plenty of terrain, cover and now getting back into the water in route....BUT I will have 2 of the marks land in wide open areas so that if the dog gets close he will pin it. The other 2 will be the same but land in thick cover. I feel it helps balance confidence in my little guy.

    Good luck, it sure is fun seeing the light turn on a little brighter every day in the young ones.
    Yes, for sure. Hard to put everything in one post..
    Like to set up pups for success. Sometimes will salt the area, if cover, even set up a bumper/bird, in plain sight. So when pup gets there, he/she will not have a big hunt. Also teaches pup to look first, use eyes.. Hate for a pup to get all the way there, not find it.

    Balance between, letting pup hunt some, and not hunting too much...yes. Really try to give pup the confidence to think.."I know, it's right HERE."

    (And, it's Charlotte. Husband does not read RTF, lol)
    Charlotte Kaiser: " The Problem Lies In The Talent."

  5. #35
    Senior Member cakaiser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Chase View Post
    Yeah, it is a little bit of a dilema when you are setting up training scenarios and you happen to have Grady running the scenario. He seems to make everything look a lot easier than it is for the other dogs. A special animal indeed!!!
    That is what the really special ones do. Make it look easy.
    Glad to read, Grady is doing what he does, so very well, indeed.
    Charlotte Kaiser: " The Problem Lies In The Talent."

  6. #36
    Senior Member Sundown49 aka Otey B's Avatar
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    Chad,Mark,Brad and Eric sure hope I can get down to a training day this Spring. The last 2 in my signature sure need some training....LOL. This year my judging schedule is more conducive of me getting to do something with my OWN dogs...
    My Dad said to me ."Son, a man just needs three things to be happy....A good dog, a good gun and a good wife.....Thank God I have all three
    Sundown's Boss of Delta Marsh JH (Louie QAA X Delta MH)
    Traveling Through The Graded Timber JH (2012 NAFC Trav X Timber MH QAA)

    Sundown's Ruff And Tuff (Boss JH X Lil Bit) best pup I have ever raised
    Home of HRCH Sundown's Loaded To The Maxx (FC AFC Jamie X Dixie QAA) RIP
    www.sundownlabs.com

  7. #37
    Senior Member roseberry's Avatar
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    i don't want to highjack a very good thread. however, in light of the great info being passed along here, i just want to say:

    it has been my pleasure to meet neighbors mr. dick and ms. charlotte kaiser during the last year. they are serious "dog folk" and most of you know their dogs and their successes better than i. their place and training grounds are spectacular and they have invited me and my dogs over regularly since we became aquainted. it is an honor to train with and to recieve advice, tips and counsel from folks like dick and charlotte.(i always listen, i hope it shows in my dogs)

    just as a highlight of the kaiser's generosity, dick attended our hrc club's Christmas party and offered to host a future club training day. his water is gonna scare a few of us hunt testers to death! truely people who put their time, work and resources into their sport.

    thanks so much charlotte!

    john mccallie
    john mccallie

  8. #38
    Senior Member Mountain Duck's Avatar
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    Thanks again everyone for the great help! Have ran a couple setups the last couple days with these suggestions in mind. Now.......if this sleet would go away (although it did make for some ducky hunting weather this morning!)
    Wildlife and Outdoor Photography

    http://www.ericrutherford.net

  9. #39
    Senior Member TonyK's Avatar
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    Eric, sounds like you are on the right track with your pup. Looking forward to seeing you this spring. I've just gotten home from two weeks of duck hunting in NE Arkansas. I came home via Louisville MS to train dogs with Charlie Moody for a couple of days. It's good to be running dogs after the winter break for hunting! Looking forward to seeing everyone soon!

    Tony K

  10. #40
    Senior Member Jennifer Henion's Avatar
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    It was nice to get straightened out about the X drill. In the book, it says it's for ALL levels and teaches depth perception. But after reading Charlotte's post and Gavin's, it's easy to see the pitfalls for a pup. True my 11 mos old did end up hunting both sides of gun on the last mark down. It's hard for an actual person to throw the bird far enough from the middle of the X to make the marks well defined.

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