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Thread: GDP shows loss

  1. #51
    Senior Member 2tall's Avatar
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    Hmmmmm...... Where are all the chicken littles that were forecasting doom to the private sector due to the elections??? DOW closed over 14k Friday? How did this happen if business is collapsing due to Obama? Certainly, I don't know enough economics to understand why things are improving some, but the dire predictions do not seem to be coming true.
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  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2tall View Post
    Hmmmmm...... Where are all the chicken littles that were forecasting doom to the private sector due to the elections??? DOW closed over 14k Friday? How did this happen if business is collapsing due to Obama? Certainly, I don't know enough economics to understand why things are improving some, but the dire predictions do not seem to be coming true.
    The Dow is 30 large stocks unequally weighted that are somewhat indicative of the where the market is headed in general. It was up around 6% last year so is not going gangbusters. The S&P 500 & the Nasdaq did provide a double digit return in an index.

    While the politico's can do a lot to damage the market, they rarely contribute to the growth of the economy as much as they would like someone who does not understand economics to believe .

    I think it's nice, just remember - if your portfolio is not at a minimum tracking the DOW's growth you're not doing well. If you have no portfolio, what has your voting for the POTUS done for you .
    Last edited by Marvin S; 02-02-2013 at 05:50 PM.
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  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marvin S View Post
    Nice charts - but what do they really say? I know that what I see is the protection of the budget with corresponding unwarranted raises in the public sector, but a loss of service. As the citizen in Seattle asked "if my garbage is going to be picked up every other week rather than weekly, will my garbage fee be lowered. We both know the answer to that .

    Like Gerry, a lowering of the defense budget does no bother me, but there is always the concern that like most government entities the essential functions will disappear 1st.
    Well Marvin, charts don't "say" anything do they? These charts present data in a form that is usually more understandable than raw numbers (i.e. picture paints a thousand words).

    The first chart shows a bit more of the story than the post by the originator of this thread
    In the forth Quarter. Now here i thought every thing is rosy with our prez back in. It is just amazing these number just come out now.
    Of course most of the right wingers in the echo chamber jumped on the bandwagon despite numerous posts that refuted the assumption that the timing of the books were cooked and presented more facts than "GDP dropped". I figured I would throw in a chart clearly showing that a drop in government spending was the primary reason for the drop in GDP even despite strong private sector growth. Given many here have stated that we are now moving toward socialism and many also espouse dramatic measures to cut government spending fast, I thought maybe someone might learn something from these facts or post a different perspective based in facts.

    The second charts presents some historical data clearly demonstrating a recovery by the private sector and a reduction in government as a percentage of GDP. I know these facts are inconsistent with the beliefs of many here in the echo chamber but I thought I would post them to see if someone would present another side of the story.

    Nice garbage story but what is it's relevance to this topic? If you view it as paying per unit of garbage disposed, it does not matter how often it gets picked up.

    I think large cuts in defense spending are needed over the long term. We spend more on it than the next 7 countries combined. Not a fiscally conservative position or policy. Cut other wasteful spending too.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry V View Post
    Private sector growth + large retractions in Gooberment spending = drop in GDP. Let's bring on more spending cuts. Clearly we need to take more austerity measures at a rapid pace.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henry V View Post
    Might as well add some more facts.
    Quote Originally Posted by Henry V View Post
    Well Marvin, charts don't "say" anything do they? These charts present data in a form that is usually more understandable than raw numbers (i.e. picture paints a thousand words).

    The first chart shows a bit more of the story than the post by the originator of this thread Of course most of the right wingers in the echo chamber jumped on the bandwagon despite numerous posts that refuted the assumption that the timing of the books were cooked and presented more facts than "GDP dropped". I figured I would throw in a chart clearly showing that a drop in government spending was the primary reason for the drop in GDP even despite strong private sector growth. Given many here have stated that we are now moving toward socialism and many also espouse dramatic measures to cut government spending fast, I thought maybe someone might learn something from these facts or post a different perspective based in facts.

    The second charts presents some historical data clearly demonstrating a recovery by the private sector and a reduction in government as a percentage of GDP. I know these facts are inconsistent with the beliefs of many here in the echo chamber but I thought I would post them to see if someone would present another side of the story.

    Nice garbage story but what is it's relevance to this topic? If you view it as paying per unit of garbage disposed, it does not matter how often it gets picked up.

    I think large cuts in defense spending are needed over the long term. We spend more on it than the next 7 countries combined. Not a fiscally conservative position or policy. Cut other wasteful spending too.
    I had hoped for your take, but a canned response is better than nothing! My take - 1st chart - Consumer spending is up, it's the holidays - construction is expanding some - Inventories are being drawn down - the military is getting an Iraq payout - & fed, state & local governments are hunkering down to protect their budget - that's my view. 2nd chart - the private sector is contibuting more percentagewise (of what?) & the public sector is doing less - though I would venture the public sector to be fairly static. I do not know what GDP stands for?

    I would venture the garbage story to be more relevant to the OP than your attempted shot at at RWer's within the echo chamber. From my vantage point I see a lot of normal people with different viewpoints. I liked the chicken farmers story very much - I would ask " Have you ever done manual labor for a living?" If you had for any period you would have a different worldview!

    I'm not a macroeconomist - it's not necessary at the level we invest. But finding niches is necessary in order to be successful, & I have a long term record through some really bad markets of doing that very well. A considerable portion of our retirement income comes from that source.

    I thought HPL post about productivity, GDP/capita & Household income to be enlightening as I have seen that over the last few years. What I do have is a serious concern about making the less employable productive in this environment, not everyone will have the shot at the American Dream as those of previous generations.
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