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Thread: How do I know what training system is best for me

  1. #41
    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JusticeDog View Post
    marvin - Do you think people didn't understand Rexx's program, or that it continued to evolve?
    To use the Biblical metaphor, his word was spread by his disciples and its interpretation was left to be disussed by those who received it ( I know I will get struck by lightning tomorrow in church)

    I know/knew a couple of original Rex Carr students and even they have evolved with the interpretation of what Rex taught them...that might be one of the beauties of whatever he taught, it has stood the test of time in all its permutations and still managed to remain relevant and viable..I don't train with an E collar but I can appreciate what the man gave the game and those that he taught directly or indirectly
    All my Exes live in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by lanse brown View Post
    A few things that I learned still ring true. "Lanse when you get a gift, say thank you and walk away. When you get a screwing walk away. You are going to get a lot more screwings than gifts"

  2. #42
    Administrator Chris Atkinson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Criquetpas View Post
    I received notes from Jeff Finley owner trainer of Topbrass Cotton fame. Jeff had attended a seminar at Rex Carr . Many of the notes were very old and were from former students. Jeff tried to school me in the Program, but, made no sense to me at all. I successfully ruined a couple of promising young Goldens trying to follow the program. In fact I got good at ruining dogs trying to make sense of the Carr methods without having first hand knowledge of Mr. Carr being there to advise me. In 1987 about 11 years later I got a Lab puppy from a litter my brother had leased his bitch out, Lakenheath Kizzie Kay bred to FC/AFC Wilderness Harley to go. She was going to be my first real collar dog. I made contact with a just turned new Field Trial Pro Leslie Karnes. Leslie had the National Derby Champion FC/AFC Donneybrooks St Jude, plus owned a couple of double header winners and National Finalists. She was a student of Rex Carr along with a friend of hers at the time Ah! Judy something her name slips my mind at the moment but believe she had a dog called Cody with a lot of All age points, maybe Dr Ed can help out. Anyway Leslie came back from a winter trip with my girl and Leslie started to school me in the handling of her. Took her home and started to freeze on the casts AFTER GETTING NICKED. It is called clamming, but, didn't know the terminology . Brought her back up to Leslie's and she educated me on how to get out of the problem. She would always say Rex would do this or Rex would do that never giving it in her own name.

    About 7 or 8 years later it started to all make sense to me. Mike Lardy came on the scene put intellectual names on them direct pressure, indirect pressure, basic, transition, advanced etc. It really started to make sense and read those notes again and again . Mike of course went on a winter trip with the late Jim Kappus before he turned pro. Jim was a Carr student of the program. Then the Curtis brothers worked for Kappus. Andy Attar and Pat Burns worked for Mike Lardy before going out on their own. I had put a young FC/AFC Mioaks Criquetpas through basics and then got help from Pat Burns for my advanced work.
    Hmm! I said maybe Mr Carr was on to something. I had a nice new puppy that was ready for basics, ran into a few problems, clamming etc, tried what Leslie through Mr Carr had taught me, it worked. Started the dog In in the Derby got a a few Derby Points and Qual JAM at about 12 or 13 months old. Sold her to Win Purtell she first went to Andy Attar, then to Mike Lardy. Fc/AFC Morgan Le Fae of Buckshot went on to accumulate about 170 all-age points until the end of her career. There were others but thanks to Mike Lardy, Wayne Curtis, Andy Attar, Pat Burns, Leslie Karnes and Mr Carr , who I never met, I now understand the program. Sometimes it takes years, but, Rex Carr is alive and well circa 2013!
    Mr. Dillow,

    Thank you sincerely for posting this recount of your experience. I really enjoyed it!

    Chris

  3. #43
    Senior Member KwickLabs's Avatar
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    Earl, I really enjoyed reading your post.

    Then....the reality of this topic returned.

    After reading your long term experiences with excellent trainers and teachers using the Carr/Lardy method, I would have to say the depth of your struggles and perseverance was exceptional and rewarding. There are many that spend years trying to thoroughly understand the program.

    However, I have one simple question. What impact and/or influence might that effort have on the young, first time dog trainer's attitude when he/she is "just thinking" about having a good dog.....and searching for a program to match his needs?
    Jim Boyer www.kwicklabs.com
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  4. #44
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    Thank you KwickLabs and Chris for your kind words. Many years ago my daughter was going to get serious with the dogs. She had been working the dogs when she was about 14 and first experience was running our old Golden at the Sportsman Show in Chicago doing retrieves in a large water tank. Years went by with the typical teen years of boys, trying do the opposite of whatever her parents suggested. She became a young women and told me she wanted to be a field trialer like Jackie Mertens, her idol. I wasnt offended because she didn't say like her dad. She later found out the journey was long and the rewards thin. A few years ago Corrine Clavey judged the Master National in Texas and made me very proud, although I have never told her. She is a 8 point across the board Jr, Sr, and Master AkC judge, hunts with me and trains with me. We have judged Master together. Field trials have not been there for her,job, family, sometimes money or lack of. I know you asked me what time it is and am building watch. I think one should get educated in what they are looking for before they decide the program. Too many first timers get very confused about what program, rather then getting the dog, correct raising first 14 weeks or so, goals, visiting the venues or hunting goals.
    Earl Dillow

  5. #45
    Senior Member Jerry S.'s Avatar
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    Everyone I know loves to run trials under Earl. So many times people think that FT's are all about distance. Earl has a well known knack for placing birds that are not real long, by FT standards, but getting results from his tests. I remember a derby a few years back where in the third series the memory bird was about 150 and the go bird was about 75 and sluiced. Those that didn't break still had some serious work on the "long" bird.
    Thanks for opening up to some of your history. I greatly appreciate it.

  6. #46
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    Evan wrote " because of the differences in the flow of information, and because a new trainer doesn't have adequate experience to sort through all that and keep his/her dog on track. It makes a difference."

    This so much a part of the program ....The continuity of the flow of info is so important....You can't lay brick from the top down and you have to do it one brick at a time ...Steve S
    "Your dog learns as much by doing his work right,by your praise and encouragement, as he does by your displeasure and correction." DLWalters

  7. #47
    Senior Member grnhd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BAYDOG View Post
    I say, look at the responses here, see who out of the Lardy's, Dobbs, Dokken's , Smartwork etc are here giving you free advice and will be available with only a phone call if you purchase their system?? There is only one I know of that will drop what he is doing, answer you call or PM , and try to talk you through it because you bought his system....Evan!! The rest ,I will almost guarantee , will blow you off and never return your call!!
    You know what,I was leaning that way for that very reason. I don't know anything about any of the programs,other than water dog,so I was thinking that someone that always seemed to be around might be a good place to start.
    Thanks for all the replys and PMs folks,they are appreciated. Now I just need to find a pup.

  8. #48
    Senior Member JusticeDog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve schreiner View Post
    Evan wrote " because of the differences in the flow of information, and because a new trainer doesn't have adequate experience to sort through all that and keep his/her dog on track. It makes a difference."

    This so much a part of the program ....The continuity of the flow of info is so important....You can't lay brick from the top down and you have to do it one brick at a time ...Steve S
    This is true. That's why for every young dog I train, I print out the flow chart from the Total Retriever Training website. As each skill is learned, I highlight it to show it has been done completely, before moving on to the next skill.

    If I am training 2 at one time, I have two of the Total Retriever Training flow charts, and have each dog's name at the top. Makes it simple.
    Susan

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  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by JusticeDog View Post
    This is true. That's why for every young dog I train, I print out the flow chart from the Total Retriever Training website. As each skill is learned, I highlight it to show it has been done completely, before moving on to the next skill.

    If I am training 2 at one time, I have two of the Total Retriever Training flow charts, and have each dog's name at the top. Makes it simple.

    Very good way to keep things straight ..Some use training journals to help with the info ...I'm with you in the fact that if you have a sound program it will last a long time ...I have been using the same one since the early 80's...Every dog goes through the same program but each dog is an individual and adjustments are made to fit the dog....Steve S
    "Your dog learns as much by doing his work right,by your praise and encouragement, as he does by your displeasure and correction." DLWalters

  10. #50
    Senior Member JusticeDog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steve schreiner View Post
    Very good way to keep things straight ..Some use training journals to help with the info ...I'm with you in the fact that if you have a sound program it will last a long time ...I have been using the same one since the early 80's...Every dog goes through the same program but each dog is an individual and adjustments are made to fit the dog....Steve S
    I use a training journal to diary the set up and/or response.... but the flow chart is kinda like marking your kid's height on the door jam...... a quick visual on where they are at.
    Susan

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