Carrier Studs vs Carrier Dams.

[mjolnir]

I am interested in knowing what the ratio of carrier FC studs being bred to clear dams vs carrier females being bred to clear FC studs and whether you place any significance in this.

[Scott Adams]

I would guess (and that is about the most accurate stat you will get) that far more carrier female's are being bred, than carrier males.
Significance?
It depends on how you see the past.
Would our dogs be as capable and sound today, without the great sires of the past?
Would another dog or dogs simply have stepped in and contributed as much?
Nobody can say for sure.

[mjolnir]

Scott, I am asking if you guess more carrier females are being bred than carrier FC males, why do you think this is the case and is there any significance to this?

[BonMallari]

Scott, I am asking if you guess more carrier females are being bred than carrier FC males, why do you think this is the case and is there any significance to this?

I can only speak from the experience we had with our carrier female Nola....her first litter to FC AFC Hiwood Jaguar produced a nice litter which included the # 2 dog on the '07 Derby list Knollwood Sweet Lily (now an FC AFC)people were on the phone asking Clint to re do the breeding and to place them on a "list" for a pup..Well he and Mr McFall decided to repeat the breeding, but in the meantime, Nola was tested and came back as a carrier...

That "list" almost disappeared overnight,people who were high on the breeding all but disappeared too..ended up selling most of the pups to hunters where they all did well, a couple of them have retrieved over 300+ birds in their hunting careers..One guy was actually offered 5k for his dog by some hunters when they saw the dog work during a Dakota pheasant/duck hunt...

I cant say that we blame people for running away from the breeding, testing and understanding exactly what being a carrier meant was so different less than five years ago..There were so many inaccurate assumptions and rumors as to what a carrier actually was as compared to what we know now...Even to this day there are many including those that hang out here on the RTF that would give just about anything for a pup out of a legendary dog that was a known carrier, and there are just as many that still consider being a carrier a somewhat defective dog...just depends on what camp you are in...my .02

[John Lash]

I would guess there's way more carrier females being bred to FC/AFC males.

For the same reason there's more JH females being bred to FC/AFC males.

I think carrier pups are fine. If I had a really exceptional affected female I would want to breed her too. Not everyone shares that belief, and I'm sure it would be hard to sell the remaining pups.

All things being equal I'd rather have a "clear." Most people are the same. There are enough clear males available to bypass the carrier males. Probably not the best course.

[Hunt'EmUp]

Female owners choose male owner get chosen. Enough said more carriers females if they have the talent will be bred. But something else to think about female carriers like any female will only have a few litters males can be bred numerous times. So breeding to breeding a certain male might might get more breeding a overall

[Scott Adams]

Scott, I am asking if you guess more carrier females are being bred than carrier FC males, why do you think this is the case and is there any significance to this?

Why do I think this is the case? As others said, the owners of females choose to breed their dog. The males are chosen by the owners of females. These breeders are choosing clear studs to avoid having to test puppies, and to avoid getting stuck with a difficult to sell carrier pup. (An unreasonable fear if you have a good stud)
Good tiltled carrier males are by passed for good titled clear studs. There is no good reason to not carefully breed carriers, whether male or female.
Significance?
Yes. It may mean a tighter gene pool down the road and the possibility of other issues arising as a result of this.

People want a clear male puppy because they believe that one day bitch owners will be knocking their door down, wanting their dogs stud services.
I think even good clear males aren't getting the breedings they should because of the stampede towards the "studs du jour".
You know far more about breeding than I Peter, so what are your thoughts?

[Brokengunz]

No one has mentioned that breeding a carrier to a clear will produce a percentage of clear and carrier pups. Therefore the carrier can be bred out of the blood line. There are some real nice dogs out there that are carriers. Also EIC testing is fairly new, a lot of the old fc afc were never tested back in the day, it just wasn't available.

[J Connolly]

Breeding a clear to a carrier will not eliminate the gene from the pool as 50% will end up carriers. The point no one seems to be making , and it is an important one, there are a lot of important traits to breed for other than breeding for clear pups. Carriers are unaffected and shouldn't be looked down on. Use the test to prevent producing affected puppies . Keep your gene pool diverse and your options open.

[hotel4dogs]

Ah, the voice of reason! Thanks for the post.

Breeding a clear to a carrier will not eliminate the gene from the pool as 50% will end up carriers. The point no one seems to be making , and it is an important one, there are a lot of important traits to breed for other than breeding for clear pups. Carriers are unaffected and shouldn't be looked down on. Use the test to prevent producing affected puppies . Keep your gene pool diverse and your options open.