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Thread: Puppy Eye Folds and Dwarfism?

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by JusticeDog View Post
    We've had this discussion before, and I'm not going to get into this on the internet. Nor, the bashing of a well respected AVCO vet. Not all puppy folds are created equal. Some mean nothing. The puppy folds for dwarfism are something to be concerned about as well all know.

    I have not had any puppies with folds of any kind. But i do know of some dogs, both labs and other breeds, that produced clear puppies later on. They were NOT the dwarfism folds.
    So its your OPINION that the above statement is not true?

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    Senior Member JusticeDog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WRL View Post
    So its your OPINION that the above statement is not true?
    Your original statement that all pups with folds will NOT get a cerf number was NOT true. I know dogs with folds that have cerf numbers.


    And now you have posted the update even that is on the cerf site.
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    I had a show bitch who had geographic folds ( I am pretty sure it was geo). At the time , nearly 20 yrs ago , the Cerf Dr said NOT to worry about them , they were similar to what Cockers have, and that he would not hesitate to breed her. I did , 3 times, and she never produced any eye issues, nor dwarfism.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridget Bodine View Post
    I had a show bitch who had geographic folds ( I am pretty sure it was geo). At the time , nearly 20 yrs ago , the Cerf Dr said NOT to worry about them , they were similar to what Cockers have, and that he would not hesitate to breed her. I did , 3 times, and she never produced any eye issues, nor dwarfism.
    Geographic folds are not associated with dwarfism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JusticeDog View Post
    Your original statement that all pups with folds will NOT get a cerf number was NOT true. I know dogs with folds that have cerf numbers.


    And now you have posted the update even that is on the cerf site.
    Geographic folds or focal folds? As I copied from Optigen, it pertains to FOCAL folds.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JusticeDog View Post
    Your original statement that all pups with folds will NOT get a cerf number was NOT true. I know dogs with folds that have cerf numbers.


    And now you have posted the update even that is on the cerf site.
    If you could copy a link from CERF saying they are now issuing CERF numbers for Labs with Geographic Folds that would be appreciated as that would be something very very new.

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    Senior Member HiRollerlabs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HiRollerlabs View Post
    The link provided to the testing information answers questions asked about CERF for dogs with folds.

    If a puppy has folds and the folds disappear when the pup is 6 months old (just picking 6 months old, nothing magical about 6 months), then should pup still be tested for OD? Or does fact that folds disappeared mean the folds were benign folds & not associated with dwarfism?
    Reading the link information it sounds like pup with folds should be tested for OD. Dogs can outgrow folds, can be carriers & not have folds or show signs of disease, but could pass the gene to offspring. Right?

    So if a puppy isn't CERF'd until it is older & folds may have disappeared, then older pup/dog should be tested for OD to rule out silent carrier status.
    Last edited by HiRollerlabs; 02-12-2013 at 11:46 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HiRollerlabs View Post
    Reading the link information it sounds like pup with folds should be tested for OD. Dogs can outgrow folds, can be carriers & not have folds or show signs of disease. Right?
    Yes, that's what it boils down to, essentially.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HiRollerlabs View Post
    Reading the link information it sounds like pup with folds should be tested for OD. Dogs can outgrow folds, can be carriers & not have folds or show signs of disease. Right?
    What kind of folds does the dog/pup have?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas D View Post
    Keith S. is kinda the guru on this subject. Maybe he will reply.
    Keith used to be, but the genetic test put him on EX-guru status.

    http://www.math.uiowa.edu/%7Estroyan/Shohola/Dwarf.htm

    About 10 years ago I met a researcher at UW-Madison who was doing research on the folds NOT related to OculoSkeletal Dysplasia (OSD = "dwarfism" in the old days).

    I recall that the part of the eye was the suspected relation, but I don't know if that research was ever published once the genetic test came out.

    ====

    There was a famous (High Point Open) dog whose folds faded out as he became older, but kept right on throwing dwarfs... The flods can fade, the defective gene doesn't...

    The fading folds are why - back in the olden days - it was important to test puppies.

    Dwarfism went down a lot between 1990 and 2010 partly because of the puppy eye tests, but now there's a better way.

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