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Thread: AKC HT Scenario, Position for Sending on a Blind

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    Senior Member cpmm665's Avatar
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    Question AKC HT Scenario, Position for Sending on a Blind

    A discussion came up the other day in training pertaining to the position a handler may send a dog on a blind. As per the AKC HT rules, page 23, section 13; Position. When ordered to retrieve, the handler shall direct his dog from any position designated by the Judges.


    Scenario: AKC Senior HT. Judges do NOT specify that dog must be sent from handlers side/heel position on a blind. Team comes to the line, handler puts dog in front facing position, sends dog on BACK. Dog successfully executes the retrieve.


    Question(s): Has anyone ever encountered this scenario? Was the handler told they could not do that? Has anyone ever been specifically instructed to send a dog on a blind from a front facing position in an AKC Senior or Master Test?

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    Senior Member DoubleHaul's Avatar
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    Yes to the last, although it seems to be more common in FTs. Never seen anyone do it on their own, though. Lining the dog is an advantage.

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    Senior Member John Robinson's Avatar
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    Like Doublehaul I've seen it numerous times in field trials, I never had to do it when I was running hunt test. The whole set up is pretty contrived and not natural to a real hunting situation.

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    Senior Member Jennifer Henion's Avatar
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    Really? Had no idea. So just to clarify: In field trials, a handler may be asked to put dog in a front sit facing it's handler to be sent on a blind?

    That is interesting! That had never occurred to me.

    In a way, I could see that as helpful in a Senior Hunt Test for someone whose dog takes poor initial lines or has a head swinging issue, but WILL take a straight BACK from a front sit.

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    A few years ago there was a long drown out thread about a MH test where the judge set up a remote send with the dog being sent from a boat.

    Bert
    Bert Rodgers

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    Senior Member DoubleHaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer Henion View Post
    Really? Had no idea. So just to clarify: In field trials, a handler may be asked to put dog in a front sit facing it's handler to be sent on a blind?

    That is interesting! That had never occurred to me.

    In a way, I could see that as helpful in a Senior Hunt Test for someone whose dog takes poor initial lines or has a head swinging issue, but WILL take a straight BACK from a front sit.
    I have run it in both FTs and HTs but more often in FTs. I agree with John that it is contrived, but many things are. Judges often will build factors such as a brush pile if their grounds don't have a lot of them, so this isn't that much different. Coming up with a hunting scenario is more difficult. Since "we don't want everyone to line this blind" you would have to be more creative, although I am sure it would somehow start with "you are running late and your buddies are already in the field"

    I can see how it might be an advantage to the right Senior dog--especially since it would feel more like FTP--but hopefully folks would not be running a dog in SH yet if they could not do such a simple blind without issues.

    If you wanted to send your dog from a remote sit in a test or trial, I would not stop you as a judge, but I think you would be hurting yourself for the most part.
    Last edited by DoubleHaul; 02-16-2013 at 11:52 AM.

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    Senior Member Jennifer Henion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleHaul View Post
    I have done it in both FTs and HTs but more often in FTs. I agree with John that it is contrived, but many things are. Judges often will build factors such as a brush pile if their grounds don't have a lot of them, so this isn't that much different. Coming up with a hunting scenario is more difficult. Since "we don't want everyone to line this blind" you would have to be more creative, although I am sure it would somehow start with "you are running late and your buddies are already in the field"

    I can see how it might be an advantage to the right Senior dog--especially since it would feel more like FTP--but hopefully folks would not be running a dog in SH yet if they could not do such a simple blind without issues.

    If you wanted to send your dog from a remote sit in a test or trial, I would not stop you as a judge, but I think you would be hurting yourself for the most part.
    Great post, thanks for the information.

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    This is a little off the topic but in a HT can a judge instruct you to not allow your dog to line the blind that if it does you have to stop it and cast it back so they can see that the dog handles.
    HRCH Dallys Wild Willow SH Born 11-06-97 Left Us 1-30-12 will always be in my thoughts RIP Willow

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Parker View Post
    This is a little off the topic but in a HT can a judge instruct you to not allow your dog to line the blind that if it does you have to stop it and cast it back so they can see that the dog handles.
    I guess he could ,but a decent judge wouldn't have to resort to something like that to get answers.
    Last edited by rbr; 02-16-2013 at 11:26 AM.
    Bert Rodgers

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Parker View Post
    This is a little off the topic but in a HT can a judge instruct you to not allow your dog to line the blind that if it does you have to stop it and cast it back so they can see that the dog handles.
    Not according to the rulebook:

    "On blind retrieves, wherever possible, the Judges shall
    plan their hunting situations taking advantage of hazards,
    such as islands, decoys, points of land, sandbars, ditches,
    hedges, small bushes, adjacent heavy cover, and rolling
    terrain. Despite such natural distractions, it shall be
    possible for a dog to find a well-planned blind-retrieve on
    the initial line from its handler;
    that it will do so is highly
    improbable because of those natural hazards, so it must be handled to the blind."

    The dog handled very well by taking initial cast from the handler and carrying it all the way to the bird.
    Tom Dorroh

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