The RetrieverTraining.Net Forums The Retriever Academy
Total Retriever Training with Mike Lardy
Hawkeye Media Gunners Up Tritronics Outdoor Media
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 26

Thread: Teachers' Union in CA proves their point ...

  1. #1
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    7,400

    Default Teachers' Union in CA proves their point ...

    John Stossel at Townhall.com

    In Los Angeles, they spent half a billion dollars to build the most expensive school in America. They planted palm trees, put in a swimming pool and spent thousands of new dollars per student.The school is beautiful, but how's the education? Not so good. The school graduates just 56 percent of its students.
    Three schools in Oakland that Ben Chavis started aren't as fancy, but the students do better. They get top test scores. And Chavis doesn't just take the most promising or richest students, as teachers unions often claim competitive schools do. Chavis' schools take kids from the poorest neighborhoods.
    So what does the education Blob decide to do? Shut his schools down.
    School board members don't like Chavis. I understand why. He's obnoxious. Arrogant. He probably broke some rules. For example, he's accused of making a profit running his schools. Horrors! A profit!
    If he did profit, I say, so what? He still got top test results with lessgovernment money. Good for him!

    They said if charter schools must exist, the union should run one, and they "would create a school where all parents would want to send their children." So New York City gave the United Federation of Teachers a charter school of its own. The union boss called it an "oasis."
    But what happened? Today, the teachers union school is one of New York's worst. It got a "D" on its city report card. Only a third of its students read at grade level. And the school still lost a million dollars.
    Yet it's the union's model school! I assume they tried their best, staffed it with some of their best teachers. The union knew we were watching. But with union rules, and the Blob's bureaucracy, they failed miserably.
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
    "Know in your heart that all things are possible. We couldn't conceive of a miracle if none ever happened." -Libby Fudim

    ​I don't use the PM feature, so just email me direct at the address shown above.

  2. #2
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    New Berlin, WI
    Posts
    10,893

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerry Clinchy View Post
    John Stossel at Townhall.com

    They said if charter schools must exist, the union should run one, and they "would create a school where all parents would want to send their children." So New York City gave the United Federation of Teachers a charter school of its own. The union boss called it an "oasis."
    But what happened? Today, the teachers union school is one of New York's worst. It got a "D" on its city report card. Only a third of its students read at grade level. And the school still lost a million dollars.
    Yet it's the union's model school! I assume they tried their best, staffed it with some of their best teachers. The union knew we were watching. But with union rules, and the Blob's bureaucracy, they failed miserably.
    Aren't all public schools essentially "charter" schools run by teachers unions???

    I mean they have unlimited cash and little if any hinderance in ANY programs and curriculum they want to offer.
    Stan b & Elvis

  3. #3
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    7,400

    Default

    But this school ... run ENTIRELY by the teachers ... was even worse than the rest of the NYC public schools. The recent figure was that 50% of students in NYC schools can't read. This "oasis" managed only 33% able to read.

    I can say that this inferiority of NYC public schools goes back a long way. My last grade in NYC schools was 3rd grade. I then went to a very small, rural school system (there were 39 in my HS graduating class) ... and I was SO far behind the rest of the class in 4th grade, it was obvious to me even at the age of 9!
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
    "Know in your heart that all things are possible. We couldn't conceive of a miracle if none ever happened." -Libby Fudim

    ​I don't use the PM feature, so just email me direct at the address shown above.

  4. #4
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    New Berlin, WI
    Posts
    10,893

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerry Clinchy View Post
    But this school ... run ENTIRELY by the teachers ... was even worse than the rest of the NYC public schools. The recent figure was that 50% of students in NYC schools can't read. This "oasis" managed only 33% able to read.

    I can say that this inferiority of NYC public schools goes back a long way. My last grade in NYC schools was 3rd grade. I then went to a very small, rural school system (there were 39 in my HS graduating class) ... and I was SO far behind the rest of the class in 4th grade, it was obvious to me even at the age of 9!
    In line with that, I coached basketball at a JUCO here in WI.
    I knew all the coaches in MIlwaukee and the burbs.

    There were some wonderfully talented kids in the MPS system that I couldn't get into a JUCO.
    We had money and programs to help them.
    I did everything I could to get them in.
    I did help a few, but many had no resources to even get to school.
    Let alone thrive.

    Some who cared couldn't meet the bare minimum which was roughly a 6th grade education.
    Many flat out couldn't read the exams.

    The coaches in the city league told me that over half of their players only came to school for practice.

    Here is the deal.
    These are human beings that deserve better!!!!

    One of the coaches told me that in his opinion that the MPS was nothing more than a "monarchy" for folks that lived in Milwaukee.
    In his opinion thay cared more about there cars & clothes than the kids education.

    The expectations for these kids was very low.
    Last edited by road kill; 03-20-2013 at 10:14 AM.
    Stan b & Elvis

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Oakdale,ct.
    Posts
    2,887

    Default

    I need to ask both of you a question; in the cases cited here, how involved do you think the parent(s) are in making sure the underachieving little Jonnys and little Suzies -

    A- go to school every day.
    B- do the homework required.
    C- take part in parent-teacher conferences to discuss their child's-children's behavior and work ethic in the classroom, and then follow up on that information to get them the help they need or to give tham a kick in the azz to get them moving.
    D- take the necessary steps to maximize the child's/children's scholastic potential. (take them to historic sites, museums, libraries, etc.)

    I know for a fact that if I had been left to my own devices, I would not have applied myself to the task of learning while in school.

    I'm not saying the Educators and Educational system within our public schools is perfect, but I don't think it is fair to blame every failure on them and the Unions they belong to. Most of us who went to Public schools were educated by teachers who were Union members. Somehow, things were different for us. I believe that difference was Parents that were interested and engaged in seeing to it that we got the most out of our educational opportunities. Of course, that is only one man's opinion.-Paul
    there's no good reason to fatten up a retriever.

  6. #6
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    New Berlin, WI
    Posts
    10,893

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by paul young View Post
    I need to ask both of you a question; in the cases cited here, how involved do you think the parent(s) are in making sure the underachieving little Jonnys and little Suzies -

    A- go to school every day.
    B- do the homework required.
    C- take part in parent-teacher conferences to discuss their child's-children's behavior and work ethic in the classroom, and then follow up on that information to get them the help they need or to give tham a kick in the azz to get them moving.
    D- take the necessary steps to maximize the child's/children's scholastic potential. (take them to historic sites, museums, libraries, etc.)

    I know for a fact that if I had been left to my own devices, I would not have applied myself to the task of learning while in school.

    I'm not saying the Educators and Educational system within our public schools is perfect, but I don't think it is fair to blame every failure on them and the Unions they belong to. Most of us who went to Public schools were educated by teachers who were Union members. Somehow, things were different for us. I believe that difference was Parents that were interested and engaged in seeing to it that we got the most out of our educational opportunities. Of course, that is only one man's opinion.-Paul
    Paul, in my case the parents were not involved at all.
    It was heartbreaking.
    We could have given these kids a chance.

    But, when I coached in JH/HS on my way up the ladder, we had homework time before practice.
    The players had to bring me a note proving their homework was done.
    No homework....no practice or play!
    (BTW--NO player ever missed a game, I had 1 player miss 1 practice, when they saw I was serious, that was the end of it!)
    Every player improved his grade, most a full letter. (f-d, d-c etc).

    I am not an "educator" by schooling yet I figured out a way to motivate these boys.
    Surely career educators would know even better ways than I?????

    Having said that (I am not claiming to be the BEST parent ever) these kids home lives were disasters.
    Most fended for themselves.

    I can't beleive I shared this here.........................................but I have my helmut on.....bring it!
    Last edited by road kill; 03-20-2013 at 10:41 AM.
    Stan b & Elvis

  7. #7
    Senior Member Quackwacker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Shady Dale Ga.
    Posts
    273

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by paul young View Post
    I need to ask both of you a question; in the cases cited here, how involved do you think the parent(s) are in making sure the underachieving little Jonnys and little Suzies -

    A- go to school every day.
    B- do the homework required.
    C- take part in parent-teacher conferences to discuss their child's-children's behavior and work ethic in the classroom, and then follow up on that information to get them the help they need or to give tham a kick in the azz to get them moving.
    D- take the necessary steps to maximize the child's/children's scholastic potential. (take them to historic sites, museums, libraries, etc.)

    I know for a fact that if I had been left to my own devices, I would not have applied myself to the task of learning while in school.

    I'm not saying the Educators and Educational system within our public schools is perfect, but I don't think it is fair to blame every failure on them and the Unions they belong to. Most of us who went to Public schools were educated by teachers who were Union members. Somehow, things were different for us. I believe that difference was Parents that were interested and engaged in seeing to it that we got the most out of our educational opportunities. Of course, that is only one man's opinion.-Paul
    I agree with this Paul. I think it should be posted in the newspaper, what parents show up for parent teacher confrence, how many times a kid is late or absent from school, etc. Parents have to step up damn it!

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Corinth MS
    Posts
    822

    Default

    I taught for 11 years and now I sub at the middle school usually one day a week. I can tell you that the waste of money In education is horrific but the majority of problems can be traced back to the lack of a family unit. The wide cultural divide between the black, Latino, and white group is not as large as it once was. All 3 groups are trending together in the absence of 2 parent homes, parental involvement, and the lack of motivation to improve their socio economic status. The sad part is our country was built to be a place where with desire anyone could improve their position through hard work and education. However, in the effort to control the people our government has created a huge group of non motivated people.

  9. #9
    Member jim_de_hunter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Amelia, Ohio
    Posts
    56

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by road kill View Post
    I am not an "educator" by schooling yet I figured out a way to motivate these boys.
    Surely career educators would know even better ways than I?????
    You had something the students wanted - they wanted to play basketball - to take away from them should they fail to perform in school. For some students there is nothing that you can take away from them to motivate them.

    Why would you assume a professional educator would make any difference?

  10. #10
    Senior Member sick lids's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    mukwonago, wi
    Posts
    450

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by road kill View Post
    In line with that, I coached basketball at a JUCO here in WI.
    I knew all the coaches in MIlwaukee and the burbs.

    There were some wonderfully talented kids in the MPS system that I couldn't get into a JUCO.
    We had money and programs to help them.
    I did everything I could to get them in.
    I did help a few, but many had no resources to even get to school.
    Let alone thrive.

    Some who cared couldn't meet the bare minimum which was roughly a 6th grade education.
    Many flat out couldn't read the exams.

    The coaches in the city league told me that over half of their players only came to school for practice.

    Here is the deal.
    These are human beings that deserve better!!!!

    One of the coaches told me that in his opinion that the MPS was nothing more than a "monarchy" for folks that lived in Milwaukee.
    In his opinion thay cared more about there cars & clothes than the kids education.

    The expectations for these kids was very low.
    I went to MPS and had quite the opposite- yet same experience. I pretty much tested out of high school in 8th grade. I could have gotten my GED in 8th grade and went to college right away. Unfortunately it doesn't work that way, instead I had to grind thru uninteresting non engaging teacher after teacher who were more or less over paid baby sitters than educators, not entirely their fault. All my classes were so far below my level that I had no need to do any of the work to pass as long as I could nearly ace the exams. I played the system. I never took home a book, never ever did home work and missed enough classes that my parents could have been jailed. All the while finding things to keep me entertained on my own, read, very bad behavior ....I still graduated a year early! As far as I was concerned at the time job well done. Now, not so smart.

    Years later when my anger subsided and me and my mother were back on speaking terms, she asked me why I didn't go to college after I had gotten accepted and enrolled at a few good local ones all on my own. I put a red hot poker in her eye and told her I graduated before they talk about how to pay for school and she never took the time to make sure I got the loans.... She teared up and apologized, she could have done better.

    MPS could have done a lot better too. Home is about 70% of our problems.

    Stan if you helped just 1 kid you probably did more for them then their parents ever have, and the saying is "If you can't wear it or drive it, it aint worth shat.".

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •