RetrieverTraining.Net - the RTF banner

Cripples and Conservation

7K views 30 replies 22 participants last post by  Chris Atkinson 
#1 ·
After reading the article titled Crippling in the recent Retriever Journal, it got me thinking. We have laws in place for the conservation of our waterfowl, such as steel shot, possession limits, shooting times, and season dates to name some. However, we have no law that requires a duck hunter to hunt with a sporting dog. Hunting with a dog would certainly conserve game more times than not. A dog would find most cripples and this fact would help to prevent Mr. Hunter from shooting another one for his bag limit while the cripple gets away and is likely obliterated from the breeding population. Furthermore, a dog would help to prevent accidents in the water because Mr. Hunter would not have to retrieve his own birds. So my thought is this: would not it be reasonable to have a law that requires waterfowl hunters to have a sporting dog of some kind with them while hunting. We have laws that state you cannot hunt with a dog, so why not have laws that state you must hunt with a dog. Trained or even just minimally trained, sporting dogs have good enough noses and natural ability to search and find a bird. If we are trying to hunt with conservation in mind and prevention of accidents, then it sure does make sense to me. Although, I love to go duck hunting, I am not a duck hunter, so I plea to those that do hunt to educate me concerning my dilemma: dogs, mandatory vs dogs, optional.
Thank you
Fon
 
See less See more
#2 ·
I think it should be a option "gun dog or not"
But you are supposed to keep up with the numbers of birds if they are (known to be knocked down) "crippled" and it added to your total. As a moral and ethical standpoint you should stop at your limit number. If you don't and your local Game and Fish Officer was watching and he/she just happened to be holding the cripple you let get away or could not find...... That would not be a good day.
 
#3 ·
Not chasing cripples results in "wanton waste of game". You are supposed to make an effort to get your cripples. Most duckhunters I see in my area chase them down in a boat.

If you want to cut down the number of duckhunters, just require a dog.
 
#6 ·
This is so very true. I have put the gun down so that I could enjoy the show on more than one occasion. Last year we had a guy set up across the way who had two dogs that would bark out of control when anything, and I mean anything was flying. If any thing came within a 100 yds the dog jumped out of the boat. It sounded like the guys were trying to call over the dogs. We were even betting on which dog was going to jump first. I'm going to do my best to not be one of those hunters with one of those dogs.
 
#5 ·
I am a retired state warden and a duck hunter. We don't need any more rules to detract from the number of people we attract to our sports. I hunt public areas almost exclusively and I wish most people would leave the dogs I see at home and fetch the duck themselves. Fifteen minutes of "fetch it up, come on boy fetch it up, fetch, Back you sob, I'm gonna kick your a$$ fetch it up!" disturbs the hunt of all around them.

Speaking as a warden a hunter is required to make a reasonable effort to retrieve their waterfowl. I believe most do. I wrote a few tickets for wanton waste for failure to retrieve. Most of the time it was for a hen they didn't want to claim. One time it was too some teenagers and 20 somethings who were blasting the heck out of wood ducks opening day and only retrieving the ones that drifted into the bank.

After a reasonable effort if you can't find the bird or the cripple escapes you are not required to count it toward your limit but morally I think you should.
 
#7 ·
There are areas that are not safe for dogs. I live in Fl and we have gators down here, I do hunt with my dog but only in places that I feel are safe. There have been times when I've lost ducks because I thought they were almost dead and sent my dog only to find out they were still alive enough to take off across the top of the water with my dog to close behind to shoot them again and they get in to the thick cattails where he can't get them.
 
#10 ·
So my thought is this: would not it be reasonable to have a law that requires.....................................
Thank you
Fon
This is the same logic anti gun nuts use to try to limit our 2nd amendment rights. Don't you think we have enough rules and laws to guide our lives?

It comes down to personal responsibility. Some have it some dont. My dog has found someone elses cripples walking along the river and I'm happy to add them to my bag. But if we do lose a bird it's one less out of my bag I get to take home
 
#18 ·
Yep!! But if it will only help ONE person it will be worth it!! NOT
 
#13 ·
Hmmm. After one hell of a lot of years waterfowling there are a large group of hunters that I would not like to see have a dog. If you hunt think about the stupid stuff you have seen and wonder if a dog should be a part of it. Just sayin!

Michigan managed waterfowl areas at one time had "dog blinds" only available to hunters with dogs. They are long gone after guys starting bringing "lap dogs" so they could hunt those blinds. Makes my point I guess.
 
#20 ·
Hobo is itching to go:p you make a very good point. He has never retrieved a duck, and he hates Chessies--- Bad Combo in the swamp!

 
#16 · (Edited)
I was 15 years old when I started duck hunting and almost 40 before I had the opportunity to hunt with a dog. We lived in apartments in suburban LA when I was young so owning a dog wasn't even a consideration. When we hunted the Dad's supervised while us boys would haul and set decoys, build blinds and retrieve birds. It was character building I guess...;)

BTW I guess we were pretty shots, plus lead was more lethal as I don't remember loosing cripples. I will say that hunting over a dog is the only way to go, especially since I don't have a teenager to order about.

John
 
#21 ·
I was 15 years old when I started duck hunting and almost 40 before I had the opportunity to hunt with a dog. We lived in apartments in suburban LA when I was young so owning a dog wasn't even a consideration. When we hunted the Dad's supervised while us boys would haul and set decoys, build blinds and retrieve birds. It was character building I guess...;)

BTW I guess we were pretty shots, plus lead was more lethal as I don't remember loosing cripples. I will say that hunting over a dog is the only way to go, especially since I don't have a teenager to order about.

John

No doubt John. I take clean shots, 35 yards would be a big stretch for me, and still have cripples. I am not a great shot, but I would guess much better than average on waterfowl. I n the ares I hunt (not including easy retrieves in rice) I would guess 30 percent would be lost. My labs are true conservationists. Seldom lose one.
 
#17 · (Edited)
My major problem is the dog retrieves birds, that others have crippled, as we're walking back in from the blind. I shoot my limit then end up with a few extra, not good. One time we'd been back to the truck for ~20min, game warden comes out want to see license, count my bird etc. as I'm talking to him, I'm semi-watching my dog messing around in some tulleys. Just as he's walking off my proud hunter comes back to stand @ heel with another bird in her mouth, luckily the warden had gotten in his truck and didn't notice the dog. :-?
 
#19 ·
I had a similar thing happen to me. It was early teal and all you could shoot were teal and wood ducks, I was at a public area where they only allowed so many hunters in I had gone in late as a replacement hunter and set up in a spot where someone else had just come out of. I found a nice clump of cattails to set up in so I put my dog stand up and told my dog to get on it , he jumped up on the stand with a mottle duck in his mouth he had found in the cattails which was not in season so I had to stash it back in the cattails so I didn't get caught with it.
 
#22 ·
NO x10

I lost my dog 2 years ago. This past year my buddy lost his dog. This year "I" was the dog. My replacement is in training. You are proposing that our group (4 guys) must lay out of hunting for the year that my dog is spending in training.

Or we would be required to purchase a working dog? The enactment of your law would drive the demand up. This would make an average lab cost $10K. IF you could find one.

More laws is never the answer.

Have you ever seen the little white plastic things that you plug into household outlets to keep kids from sticking stuff in them? They are a good idea. I don't want someone enacting a law saying I must have them.

Remember this:
Every law takes a freedom away from someone!
 
#23 ·
This is another good point I never thought of. U r absolutely correct about having to spend more $$$ plus having to wait @ for a dog to get trained. Laws of supply & demand work everywhere, including here. I get so tired of, as previous posts mentioned, hunters w/out dogs wasting a duck b/c someone couldn't find it or was too lazy to look for it. I guess there really is not more ways of preventing this.
 
#30 ·
#28 ·
I love hunting with my dog, but making people have a dog to hunt ducks - NO! It was said early it comes down to ethics and morals. Quick story. A buddy and I were jump shooting ducks in the creeks one afternoon - this during our annual archery hunting camp so no dogs with us. He knocked down his third wood duck which was his first ever limit of woodies. Well that duck laid on the other side of a swollen late October creek and no way to cross near by without getting wet. Without heistation he said hold my gun and started to strip down to his tighty whities and jumped in and swam across. He retrieved his duck and while getting dressed we heard a voice and noticed a bowhunter in a tree stand about 50 yards or so away on the other side of the creek - he was praising my buddies retrieving skills. This wasn't thr first time someone swam to get a duck and most certainly won't be the last. It was the way we were brought up whether swimming to get a duck or tracking a wounded deer for two days. You go until you can't absolutely go anymore. period! Forcing people to hunt with dogs won't fix the real issues. JMO
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top