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Thread: Trace(Hunt Dog) jumps and catches a Canadian Goose

  1. #11
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    I agree Travis.

    By hiding our hunting activities we are accepting the idea that there is something wrong either moraly or ethically with hunting.

    I am not willing to accept this just because some tree huggers make alot of noise against our activities.

    Maybe we as hunters should band together and be heard rather staying quiet and hiding our hunting heritages/traditions to appease those that disagree with hunting.

    If everyone takes the position that we should hide our hunting activities it will be easier for the antis to get their way and then we will all be playing video games about hunting and our dogs will only get to retrieve rubber ducks and that isn't anything myself or my dogs would like to see for our future.

    -Cameron

  2. #12
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    HPL, I don't know you from Adam. I rarely frequent the board much anymore but Chris called this morning saying someone posted a clip of my footage that didn't appear from me.

    We are going to have to agree to disagree. I used to think like you. But you see when you follow the thought process you've laid out you begin to compromise the ideals and reality of not only hunting but the world we live in. Once we begin to compromise, we begin to lose. To compromise you have to give in, the more you give in the less you end up with. I've since made a choice to make a stand. My stance is that death is a part of life and as humans we are the top predator. I can eat lettuce that I cut from the plant and I can eat a steak from a cow that was shot in the head with a 4" bolt as it was drug up a conveyor belt by a chain because that's reality. You may not like what you seen in the clip, but what happened in the clip is reality, for us to hunt and be successful then death will occur and I refuse to sugar coat it or walk of camera to accommodate some wacko liberal that thinks lions and antelope sleep together in peace.

  3. #13
    Senior Member HPL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn S. View Post
    I quit sugar coating what we as hunters do in the field to appease the anti's.

    Shawn Stahl

    In my reply I should have said that my first post wasn't intended as a personal attack, but as a reminder that hunting is under attack and that handing the enemy ammunition is probably not in our best interest. Also, not showing the more brutal (for lack of a better word) aspects of our sport is not appeasing the antis (appease: placate or pacify by acceding to demands). The antis don't want hunters to stop VIDEOING our activities, they want us to STOP KILLING things. Period. Presenting them with images that they could use to sway the public against us is just shooting ourselves in the foot. I'll talk to anybody about hunting. I'll tell anybody that I hunt and that I have killed many innocent little critters. If they are eating meat or wearing leather I'll be glad to ridicule their position as totally illogical, but I'm not going to give antis video of a wounded animal gasping out its last breath just before I finish it off. Just NOT an image that I want them to have. I've seen some pretty grisly things where folks took shots they shouldn't have. I wouldn't have recorded them nor would I talk or write about them in graphic detail. Just doesn't do our cause any good. The public should see hunters as intelligent environmentalists who have done more to preserve our natural resources than any other group. All shots should be perceived by the public as quick, humane, (instant) kills or clean misses. The cool part of your video is the dog jumping up and catching the goose. The rest didn't really add anything of value. That's all I'm saying.

    I should say again, the shot of the dog catching the goose is really cool.
    Last edited by HPL; 03-26-2013 at 12:27 PM.
    Any doctrine that weakens personal responsibility for judgment and for action helps create the attitudes that welcome and support the totalitarian state.
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  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by HPL View Post
    In my reply I should have said that my first post wasn't intended as a personal attack, but as a reminder that hunting is under attack and that handing the enemy ammunition is probably not in our best interest. Also, not showing the more brutal (for lack of a better word) aspects of our sport is not appeasing the antis (appease: placate or pacify by acceding to demands). The antis don't want hunters to stop VIDEOING our activities, they want us to STOP KILLING things. Period. Presenting them with images that they could use to sway the public against us is just shooting ourselves in the foot. I'll talk to anybody about hunting. I'll tell anybody that I hunt and that I have killed many innocent little critters. If they are eating meat or wearing leather I'll be glad to ridicule their position as totally illogical, but I'm not going to give antis video of a wounded animal gasping out its last breath just before I finish it off. Just NOT an image that I want them to have. I've seen some pretty grisly things where folks took shots they shouldn't have. I wouldn't have recorded them nor would I talk or write about them in graphic detail. Just doesn't do our cause any good. The public should see hunters as intelligent environmentalists who have done more to preserve our natural resources than any other group. All shots should be perceived by the public as quick, humane, (instant) kills or clean misses. The cool part of your video is the dog jumping up and catching the goose. The rest didn't really add anything of value. That's all I'm saying.
    (appease: placate or pacify by acceding to demands) aka...compromising our values. I realize we are both playing for the same team. I'm just drawing my line in the sand a little deeper and further back than you are.

    Shawn Stahl

  5. #15
    Senior Member HPL's Avatar
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    I'm going to continue this a little more. My brother doesn't hunt. I don't actually know if he is actually against hunting or not. He has twin daughters. Several years ago they were home for Christmas and I wanted to take the girls (probably around 17 or 18) with me on a dove hunt. They wouldn't have been able to hunt, but I thought the experience would have been something interesting for the girls to experience and I thought they would like to see the dog do what he does. My brother wouldn't let them go because he thought it would be too upsetting. Well, we had dove for supper a couple of nights later and one of the girls instantly made the decision that we should go kill more of those tasty little morsels. The point here is that I am perfectly happy to expose folks in real life to what happens on a hunt as long as I am there to give it context. I'll take the most ardent anti hunter along if they want to go and will not actually interfere with my activities in the field, but again, I would be there to put everything in context. I am an advisory board member on our local chapter of Quail Coalition, and am perfectly willing to speak out in defense of hunting and most hunters anytime, anywhere but I do think that our actions can have a profound effect on how the non-hunting public views our sport.
    Any doctrine that weakens personal responsibility for judgment and for action helps create the attitudes that welcome and support the totalitarian state.
    (John Dewey)

    Associate yourself with men of good quality if you esteem your own reputation; for 'tis better to be alone than in bad company.
    (George Washington)

    Gig'em Aggies!! BTCO'77HOO t.u.!!

    www.HughLieck.photoshelter.com

  6. #16
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    HPL, I agree that our actions do have a profound impact, that's why I refuse to hide actions. If an anti wants ammo then they will get it. Kudos to you for being active in our defense. I'm done debating on what shade of red we think is the better.

  7. #17
    Senior Member KevinsKennels's Avatar
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    Very nice!! Good dog there boy!
    Captain Drake of Dutchess "Drake"
    Kodiak Miss Angel "Koda" R.I.P.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Schneider View Post
    I wish more hunters out there had this mindset.
    Couldn't agree more!

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by HPL View Post
    I'm a hunter. Have been since I first went dove hunting with my grandfather when I was about 7 yrs old (1962). Have wrung plenty of necks, pulled heads off, walked up and shot wounded deer, hogs, and nilgai in the head, and shot hogs in traps. I get what happens in the field. The goose was injured. It's humane to wring the neck. Better death than most wild creatures get, yada, yada, yada, but if you think hunting is safe in today's society, you are delusional. Haven't I been reading about places where they can no longer use live fliers at hunt tests and field trials? Didn't some midwest state just cancel dove season again (after only having re-instated it a couple of years ago)? Haven't I been reading about gun bans? How hard would it have been to step out of the frame (or edit out that few seconds) to help protect our sport? Hunters are a small minority of the US population. It wouldn't take that much to sway public opinion completely against us. It is foolish to be posting the less attractive parts of our sport for our enemies to see.

    If they started running footage of what happens in slaughter houses, there would be a lot more vegetarians.
    With all due respect, you have fallen victim to this country's demise - political correctness.

  10. #20
    Senior Member HPL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Schneider View Post
    I wish more hunters out there had this mindset.
    Quote Originally Posted by C. Johnson View Post
    I agree Travis.

    By hiding our hunting activities we are accepting the idea that there is something wrong either moraly or ethically with hunting.

    I am not willing to accept this just because some tree huggers make alot of noise against our activities.

    Maybe we as hunters should band together and be heard rather staying quiet and hiding our hunting heritages/traditions to appease those that disagree with hunting.

    If everyone takes the position that we should hide our hunting activities it will be easier for the antis to get their way and then we will all be playing video games about hunting and our dogs will only get to retrieve rubber ducks and that isn't anything myself or my dogs would like to see for our future.

    -Cameron

    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn S. View Post
    (appease: placate or pacify by acceding to demands) aka...compromising our values. I realize we are both playing for the same team. I'm just drawing my line in the sand a little deeper and further back than you are.

    Shawn Stahl
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn S. View Post
    HPL, I agree that our actions do have a profound impact, that's why I refuse to hide actions. If an anti wants ammo then they will get it. Kudos to you for being active in our defense. I'm done debating on what shade of red we think is the better.
    Quote Originally Posted by thebigcat View Post
    Couldn't agree more!
    Ya'll are just going to have to explain the logic behind these thoughts. How does recording and showing the harder parts of the sport of hunting further our cause? How does projecting a more public friendly view hurt our cause? How is projecting the best parts of the sport while leaving out the things that could provide ammunition to our enemies turning our backs on our values? Personally, I have never really enjoyed wringing necks or pulling heads off and I have been doing it for about 50 years.

    In 2011 approximately 15.5 million Americans went hunting (http://www.doi.gov/news/pressrelease...eport-2011.pdf). Certainly there are people who consider themselves hunters didn't actually hunt in 2011 and if we were to be really generous and double the number to take in all the hunters who didn't hunt in 2011, that would give us 31 million hunters in the US. There are about 313 million people in the US, making hunters somewhere around 10% of the population (again, using a pretty liberal estimate of total hunters) and in fact in 2011 only about 6% of the population actually hunted. Interestingly, migratory game bird hunters are the second smallest cohort in the group at about 2.6 million participants. An "in your face" attitude by a small minority seems unlikely to me to make the rest of the folks look favorably on that minority. It just seems smart to me to promote our sport using public images that are actually likely to make the public view us in a positive light. I don't see how the blood and guts images or the images where we are "finishing off" wounded animals are likely to help us gain approval with anyone other than sociopaths. If you can really explain how those images are likely to make the non-hunting public (basically 90%+ of the population) view hunters in a favorable way I'd love to hear it.

    Quote Originally Posted by kigiin View Post
    With all due respect, you have fallen victim to this country's demise - political correctness.
    That's really funny. Any of the folks who actually know me who read that would be on the ground rolling, I guarantee it.
    Last edited by HPL; 03-26-2013 at 06:44 PM.
    Any doctrine that weakens personal responsibility for judgment and for action helps create the attitudes that welcome and support the totalitarian state.
    (John Dewey)

    Associate yourself with men of good quality if you esteem your own reputation; for 'tis better to be alone than in bad company.
    (George Washington)

    Gig'em Aggies!! BTCO'77HOO t.u.!!

    www.HughLieck.photoshelter.com

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