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Thread: Trace(Hunt Dog) jumps and catches a Canadian Goose

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by HPL View Post
    Ya'll are just going to have to explain the logic behind these thoughts. How does recording and showing the harder parts of the sport of hunting further our cause? How does projecting a more public friendly view hurt our cause? How is projecting the best parts of the sport while leaving out the things that could provide ammunition to our enemies turning our backs on our values? Personally, I have never really enjoyed wringing necks or pulling heads off and I have been doing it for about 50 years.

    In 2011 approximately 15.5 million Americans went hunting (http://www.doi.gov/news/pressrelease...eport-2011.pdf). Certainly there are people who consider themselves hunters didn't actually hunt in 2011 and if we were to be really generous and double the number to take in all the hunters who didn't hunt in 2011, that would give us 31 million hunters in the US. There are about 313 million people in the US, making hunters somewhere around 10% of the population (again, using a pretty liberal estimate of total hunters) and in fact in 2011 only about 6% of the population actually hunted. Interestingly, migratory game bird hunters are the second smallest cohort in the group at about 2.6 million participants. An "in your face" attitude by a small minority seems unlikely to me to make the rest of the folks look favorably on that minority. It just seems smart to me to promote our sport using public images that are actually likely to make the public view us in a positive light. I don't see how the blood and guts images or the images where we are "finishing off" wounded animals are likely to help us gain approval with anyone other than sociopaths. If you can really explain how those images are likely to make the non-hunting public (basically 90%+ of the population) view hunters in a favorable way I'd love to hear it.



    That's really funny. Any of the folks who actually know me who read that would be on the ground rolling, I guarantee it.
    You're talking out of both sides of your mouth. You say that you're not politically correct yet you ask for justification regarding the statements made above? The rest of us feel strongly that we shouldn't have to "sugar coat" what we do in the field as hunters. The reason there are so many different political affiliations, religions, pastimes, activities and special interest groups is because not everyone will agree to one agenda. As a hunter, retriever enthusiast or outdoorsman you'd think we could avoid wasting cycles discussing the potential political correctness of the sports we enjoy and focus on more productive conversations.

  2. #22
    Senior Member HPL's Avatar
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    You're the one who suggested that Political Correctness had somehow entered here. My position is, and has been for a long time, that we, as hunters, need to be cognizant of how the general populace views us and our actions. I don't see that as being "Politically Correct". Just because one doesn't wish to be "politically correct" doesn't mean that one should be stupid. Perhaps one could call it "Politically Aware" or "enlightened self interest". The politically correct thing to do would be to quit hunting and condemn those who still hunt. A discussion about how we project ourselves and our sport to others is probably one of (if not the) most important discussions we could have, esp at this time when the whole country is all worked up over guns and their uses. I would prefer that the anti hunting crowd had as difficult a time as possible in painting hunters as a bunch of redneck neanderthals operating under the influence of an unquenchable blood lust. A few hard nosed boobs can easily do as much damage to the sport of hunting as a legion of leftwing nutjobs. Surely you realize that there are lots of people out there who never want to really know where meat comes from. I haven't seen any Southwestern Cattle Growers ads recently that were shot in an abattoir. Slaughterhouse scenes were never a part of the "Eat Beef" campaign. There is a reason for that. When projecting images of hunters and hunting, at least act smart.

    And again, this was not meant as a personal attack on the OP, more of a gentle remonstration or perhaps, just a reminder that others are almost certainly watching.
    Last edited by HPL; 03-26-2013 at 08:13 PM.
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  3. #23
    Senior Member copterdoc's Avatar
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    Hunt naked!!!!!

  4. #24
    Administrator Chris Atkinson's Avatar
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    Brother Shawn,

    Thanks for stopping by and posting on RTF.

    Just today I talked with a local callmaker. He mentioned a guy's name whom he claimed was the best goose caller of all time. I bet you can guess his name. He does a little film work with RNTV.

    Anyhow, my apologies that one of the debate team regulars chose to stay sharp on this one.

    See you this Spring, I hope.

    Chris
    "Determining and applying the criteria for when and when not to use correction is the essence of the art of dog training. I make a distinction between a mistake and a lack of effort." - Mike Lardy - Volume I "After Collar Conditioning"

  5. #25
    Senior Member HPL's Avatar
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    Well, Chris, you know that our image (killers of defenseless wee critters) is one issue that I think we should all be thinking about regularly. I don't think that I attacked anyone here. I am genuinely curious as to the reasoning of folks who think that we can be cavalier in the images we share on the net. I AM offended that you would feel it necessary to apologize for a civil and intelligent discussion. I really liked the footage of the dog catching the goose. Really cool stuff. I think that an ongoing discussion of how we (hunters) see ourselves vs. how the non-hunting public may see us is important. Open and civil intercourse can be enlightening. We have similar roundtables frequently in my personal circle. Gets pretty boring if everyone always has the same idea. So, I hope Shawn wasn't offended. As a fellow hunter, I would probably enjoy his company but I would still probably be trying to convince him that mine is the better way .

    One might look at this as being similar to whether you would think someone applying a heeling stick to their dog at a crowded public park was a good idea. I could be wrong, but I bet most here would consider that to be a poor choice.
    Any doctrine that weakens personal responsibility for judgment and for action helps create the attitudes that welcome and support the totalitarian state.
    (John Dewey)

    Associate yourself with men of good quality if you esteem your own reputation; for 'tis better to be alone than in bad company.
    (George Washington)

    Gig'em Aggies!! BTCO'77HOO t.u.!!

    www.HughLieck.photoshelter.com

  6. #26
    Senior Member HPL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by copterdoc View Post
    Hunt naked!!!!!
    Too many thorns in South Texas, but knock yourself out up there in the frigid north!!
    Any doctrine that weakens personal responsibility for judgment and for action helps create the attitudes that welcome and support the totalitarian state.
    (John Dewey)

    Associate yourself with men of good quality if you esteem your own reputation; for 'tis better to be alone than in bad company.
    (George Washington)

    Gig'em Aggies!! BTCO'77HOO t.u.!!

    www.HughLieck.photoshelter.com

  7. #27
    Administrator Chris Atkinson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HPL View Post
    Well, Chris, you know that our image (killers of defenseless wee critters) is one issue that I think we should all be thinking about regularly. I don't think that I attacked anyone here. I am genuinely curious as to the reasoning of folks who think that we can be cavalier in the images we share on the net. I AM offended that you would feel it necessary to apologize for a civil and intelligent discussion. I really liked the footage of the dog catching the goose. Really cool stuff. I think that an ongoing discussion of how we (hunters) see ourselves vs. how the non-hunting public may see us is important. Open and civil intercourse can be enlightening. We have similar roundtables frequently in my personal circle. Gets pretty boring if everyone always has the same idea. So, I hope Shawn wasn't offended. As a fellow hunter, I would probably enjoy his company but I would still probably be trying to convince him that mine is the better way .

    One might look at this as being similar to whether you would think someone applying a heeling stick to their dog at a crowded public park was a good idea. I could be wrong, but I bet most here would consider that to be a poor choice.
    Hugh, I was a little embarrassed. Shawn and I judged the minor stakes together at a trial a few months ago and we discussed why he does not frequent or post on RTF much.

    Then, I called him today to check and see if that was indeed him and his dog on the video. So Shawn chooses to read and post...then he gets sucked into a silly debate that starts off with this post:

    Pretty cool, but that guy was foolish to ring the goose's neck on camera. I want to know how the goose ended up just wandering around in the spread with those guys all standing around.
    Shawn decides to try and answer why the goose ended up in the spread with the guys standing and had to deal with someone with a case of "last-word-itis".

    I was embarrassed Hugh.

    If that offends you. It offends you.

    But that's how I honestly felt.

    Chris
    "Determining and applying the criteria for when and when not to use correction is the essence of the art of dog training. I make a distinction between a mistake and a lack of effort." - Mike Lardy - Volume I "After Collar Conditioning"

  8. #28
    Senior Member Lonnie Spann's Avatar
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    That is really cool!

    Lonnie Spann
    DISCLAIMER: The above post is the opinionated and biased view of your's truly, Lonnie Spann, and is in no way intended to reflect the opinions or views of the unfortunate individuals named below who just happen to be doomed with guilt by association.

    Member of CAHRC and North AL HRC. I train with AND AM FRIENDS WITH: Fishduck, Laidback, Splash_Em, RF2, Drake2014, Claimsadj, Hooked on Quackers, RookieTrainer and Roseberry.

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  9. #29
    Senior Member shawninthesticks's Avatar
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    I bet my dog could do that to if she had as many opportunities to try as Shawn's dogs do.
    Shawn White

    HR Big Creek Retrievers Independence Day JH QAA "Indy "

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn White View Post
    I bet my dog could do that to if she had as many opportunities to try as Shawn's dogs do.
    The day after Shawn and I judged the minor stakes last Fall, he and some partners loaded up and went on the road for the real thing....not a trial.
    "Determining and applying the criteria for when and when not to use correction is the essence of the art of dog training. I make a distinction between a mistake and a lack of effort." - Mike Lardy - Volume I "After Collar Conditioning"

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