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Thread: Higher Education

  1. #1
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
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    Default Higher Education

    http://townhall.com/columnists/walte...pools-n1575006

    Klingenstein decided to check out Mills' commitment to diverse perspectives by commissioning the National Association of Scholars to examine Bowdoin's intellectual diversity, rigorous academics and civic identity. Its report -- "What Does Bowdoin Teach?" -- isn't pretty. T

    here are "no curricular requirements that center on the American founding or the history of the nation."
    Even history majors aren't required to take a single course in American history. In the history department, no course is devoted to American political, military, diplomatic or intellectual history; the only ones available are organized around some aspect of race, class, gender or sexuality.
    How can a history major possibly understand world history, if they do not have a basis in any American history? It then comes as no surprise that it is impossible for them to understand how and why America became America, or understand the importance of the Constitution; or understand how the country was willing to sacrifice so many lives to right the wrong of slavery & strive to live up to its founding ideals.
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    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerry Clinchy View Post
    http://townhall.com/columnists/walte...pools-n1575006



    How can a history major possibly understand world history, if they do not have a basis in any American history? It then comes as no surprise that it is impossible for them to understand how and why America became America, or understand the importance of the Constitution; or understand how the country was willing to sacrifice so many lives to right the wrong of slavery & strive to live up to its founding ideals.
    If they do begin to understand, the progressive agenda will be contradicted.

    We can't have that!!!!
    Last edited by road kill; 04-24-2013 at 02:05 PM.
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    Senior Member Jason Glavich's Avatar
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    This is a problem in most levels of education now. We have been teaching students the history of specifc race or other creed and we do not focus on the nation or world as a whole. Some seem to think that they exist seperately instead of the fact they exist together and helped form each others history. There is a lot of useless teaching going on in colleges to make a profit, classes I do not need but I will have to take for a degree are down right stupid in every sense of the word. The classes that could actually benefit myself as a person are not required, but have no fear I will learn all about Zombies in literature(Real class), and Dance around the world(Real Class),Vampires in literature(Real as well) but have no requirements to take History courses.
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    Senior Member Buzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Glavich View Post
    This is a problem in most levels of education now. We have been teaching students the history of specifc race or other creed and we do not focus on the nation or world as a whole. Some seem to think that they exist seperately instead of the fact they exist together and helped form each others history. There is a lot of useless teaching going on in colleges to make a profit, classes I do not need but I will have to take for a degree are down right stupid in every sense of the word. The classes that could actually benefit myself as a person are not required, but have no fear I will learn all about Zombies in literature(Real class), and Dance around the world(Real Class),Vampires in literature(Real as well) but have no requirements to take History courses.

    The things people find to be outraged about.


    Here is a listing of the offerings by their history department:

    http://www.bowdoin.edu/catalogue/cou.../courses.shtml


    Here are their requirements. For the life of me, i cannot figure out why they should REQUIRE them to take any American History. There are plenty of American History offerings in their catalog. In fact they require some study of non-Euro/U.S. courses, which sorta tells me that maybe students are too interested in America and Europe and need to be pushed to broaden their horizons.

    The major consists of ten courses, with the following stipulations:

    1. No more than two courses below the 200 level may count toward the major, and these must be taken prior to the junior year.
    2. Students may not count toward the major more than six courses in a single field of study. (Students may count transregional courses toward any one of the fields they cover.)
    3. Non-Euro/U.S. courses: Majors take at least four courses in fields outside of Europe and the United States. These courses may include courses taken in the transregional fields (Atlantic Worlds and Colonials Worlds), which count toward at least one non-Euro/U.S. field. Transregional courses may count toward any one of their designated field areas, but a single course may not count toward more than one field area.
    4. Pre-modern course: One pre-modern course (courses designated by professors).
    5. Advanced seminars: Three courses above the level of 200-lecture courses (i.e., 200-level intermediate seminars, 300-level research seminars, 400-level advanced independent studies, or honors). These courses must be taken in at least two fields (a single course may not count toward more than one field).
    6. Capstone: One of the three advanced seminars must be a 300-level capstone seminar. In consultation with a faculty advisor, a major may fulfill this requirement with an honors project. Students are expected to have concentrated their studies in the field in which the capstone is taken by having taken at least two prior courses in the field.
    Last edited by Buzz; 04-24-2013 at 03:56 PM.
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    Member jim_de_hunter's Avatar
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    Okay, before this gets out of hand again. Do we have any certified History experts on this list? You know, perhaps someone holding a Bachelor's or Master's degree in the topic. Maybe written a published paper or two. Perhaps an article for a magazine or journal. Maybe a history book or text. Anyone....? Anyone.....?

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    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim_de_hunter View Post
    Okay, before this gets out of hand again. Do we have any certified History experts on this list? You know, perhaps someone holding a Bachelor's or Master's degree in the topic. Maybe written a published paper or two. Perhaps an article for a magazine or journal. Maybe a history book or text. Anyone....? Anyone.....?
    Most here on POTUS are experts on Revisionist History 101....with a minor in Spin History 2.0....the only person old enough to have actually lived through some of this might be Marvin S., He might just be the Methusaleh of the RTF...Cary A is actually a Dr.(dentist)..Jeff G, has a post graduate degree or two...there are a couple on here that are attorneys of various levels....

    the rest of us might have college degrees or not , but rarely show any use or grasp of what we may have learned, and show that we all skipped out on Common Sense 101....
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    Senior Member Brad Turner's Avatar
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    I completed some graduate courses in history while completing my masters. These courses were electives. The selection of 5000 level courses was quite limited. All of the courses were very specific in content. I assume that this is the point at the graduate level.

    I believe that the greater tragedy is allowing students to graduate from high school without a thorough understanding of American history. Although it's not surprising considering they can graduate without being able to read.
    Last edited by Brad Turner; 04-24-2013 at 06:08 PM.
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    Senior Member Buzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brad Turner View Post
    I believe that the greater tragedy is allowing students to graduate from high school without a thorough understanding of American history. Although it's not surprising considering they can graduate without being able to read.
    I was going to make that point in my post but got distracted and forgot. My daughter is finishing up a year of American History in 8th grade and come to think of it that's the last time I took any. I did take high school civics and college American Government though. I have heard that they don't teach civics any more and I don't believe I recall that being on my daughter's high school schedule either. She recently had to pencil out her entire high school schedule. I was actually mostly happy with the offerings that her school makes available.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by BonMallari View Post
    Most here on POTUS are experts on Revisionist History 101....with a minor in Spin History 2.0....the only person old enough to have actually lived through some of this might be Marvin S., He might just be the Methusaleh of the RTF...Cary A is actually a Dr.(dentist)..Jeff G, has a post graduate degree or two...there are a couple on here that are attorneys of various levels....

    the rest of us might have college degrees or not , but rarely show any use or grasp of what we may have learned, and show that we all skipped out on Common Sense 101....
    Little of the history I was exposed to in my younger days went beyond the Anglo Saxon theory of what was good along with the line that what FDR was doing was great. American Indians were always the bad guys, but IMO, if there is a group that has suffered mightily at the hands of the ruling class it is those folks. Like Buzz there were few offerings beyond grade 8 that really taught much & were generally delivered to create max boredom. But I do understand the need for 3 functioning branches of government with folks in place that can defend their territory without the desire to enlarge same.

    Like Bon says "I've lived through a lot of history" & in my later years have more time to read what looks & is interesting. A lot of the history I picked up along the way came by way of Michener's books, the writings of Thomas Sowell & more recently I read "he Barbarous Years" by a Harvard History Prof Emeritus. I've read the book about the various POTUS's in recent times & have found most wanting, am waiting on the library list for Coolidge. All of the recent readings are far superior to what was taught during my days in school. You ask yourself "Was this due to the fact that that was considered best available knowledge or were the teachers of yesteryear just as curricula challenged as those today with little reason to exert a little personal incentive?"

    While we received little in the humanities while garnering an engineering education, what we did receive was an ability, after reading some very dry technical stuff, to be more objective about separating the wheat from the chaff. (JD will probably critique that sentence but I believe it makes it's point) I do enjoy reading high quality magazines, of which few remain, but there are some. How many of you read the New Yorker? A lot of garbage but in amongst that there will be a real pearl & their toons are really very edgy & good.

    If you don't read Forbes (industrial history), National Review (political history & current events), the various CATO publications & the techs (Wired, Inc, Scientific American) you are missing a lot of what happens or will happen in our world - past, present & future .

    Quote Originally Posted by jim_de_hunter View Post
    Okay, before this gets out of hand again. Do we have any certified History experts on this list? You know, perhaps someone holding a Bachelor's or Master's degree in the topic. Maybe written a published paper or two. Perhaps an article for a magazine or journal. Maybe a history book or text. Anyone....? Anyone.....?
    My son hired a guy with a Master in History (with honors) - guy couldn't even drive a riding lawn mower - Could you please tell me what someone with the credentials you describe could add to this conversation? BTW - to graduate in the discipline I received my degree in one had to write a thesis. In the library at the UW there is a publication done by myself . In the real world no one asked me if I had ever been published nor did they ever ask me my GPA after I had been in the working world for 6 months.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzz View Post
    The things people find to be outraged about.


    Here is a listing of the offerings by their history department:

    http://www.bowdoin.edu/catalogue/cou.../courses.shtml


    Here are their requirements. For the life of me, i cannot figure out why they should REQUIRE them to take any American History. There are plenty of American History offerings in their catalog. In fact they require some study of non-Euro/U.S. courses, which sorta tells me that maybe students are too interested in America and Europe and need to be pushed to broaden their horizons.

    The major consists of ten courses, with the following stipulations:

    1. No more than two courses below the 200 level may count toward the major, and these must be taken prior to the junior year.
    2. Students may not count toward the major more than six courses in a single field of study. (Students may count transregional courses toward any one of the fields they cover.)
    3. Non-Euro/U.S. courses: Majors take at least four courses in fields outside of Europe and the United States. These courses may include courses taken in the transregional fields (Atlantic Worlds and Colonials Worlds), which count toward at least one non-Euro/U.S. field. Transregional courses may count toward any one of their designated field areas, but a single course may not count toward more than one field area.
    4. Pre-modern course: One pre-modern course (courses designated by professors).
    5. Advanced seminars: Three courses above the level of 200-lecture courses (i.e., 200-level intermediate seminars, 300-level research seminars, 400-level advanced independent studies, or honors). These courses must be taken in at least two fields (a single course may not count toward more than one field).
    6. Capstone: One of the three advanced seminars must be a 300-level capstone seminar. In consultation with a faculty advisor, a major may fulfill this requirement with an honors project. Students are expected to have concentrated their studies in the field in which the capstone is taken by having taken at least two prior courses in the field.
    I took a look at the courses offered and it pretty much shows that bad journalism has it niche among the political trash sites, fact checking regards............

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