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Thread: Non collar trainers, what do you do when you get a no-go?

  1. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by jd6400 View Post
    A wise man once told me ,"all of em will go as long as it`s under their conditions" that's all I`m sayin as I have no "pelts". Jim
    That is very true...All will go when they want to.....But ..it takes a trained dog to go when they don't want to go...Steve S
    "Your dog learns as much by doing his work right,by your praise and encouragement, as he does by your displeasure and correction." DLWalters

  2. #112
    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jd6400 View Post
    A wise man once told me ,"all of em will go as long as it`s under their conditions" that's all I`m sayin as I have no "pelts". Jim
    You might not have any with your own name on them, but you have seen up close and personal, how those pelts were made and acquired, you know more than most absentee owners whose name might be on those pelts, but couldn't tell you how they got there...Pelts are very nice,very few have them, but the knowledge of how to train for them is held by even fewer
    All my Exes live in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by lanse brown View Post
    A few things that I learned still ring true. "Lanse when you get a gift, say thank you and walk away. When you get a screwing walk away. You are going to get a lot more screwings than gifts"

  3. #113
    Senior Member polmaise's Avatar
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    Steve Schreiner wrote :"All will go when they want to.....But ..it takes a trained dog to go when they don't want to go.."
    In the spirit of the OP , I am having a problem understanding what this means?
    Psychologically if the dog is trained to go,surely it would want to go, whether it was trained to any programme? If it takes a trained dog to go when it doesn't want to go, then is it trained,or just compliant?..Just trying to get my head round the comment..I don't have to tell my dog's to sit ,they just do when I stop! So I take it they have learned to sit without being told!..They don't Go until I tell them to go! so they must have learned 'not to go until I say go.
    But when they ''don't want to go" ! is the OP's issue! ..So is the answer in the training of that dog and handler,not the dog.(irrespective of previous achievements) .
    Short statement that meant a lot 'Steve' Hope you don't mind me using your quote as an expression.
    One Shooter One Spaniel One Retriever

  4. #114
    Senior Member JS's Avatar
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    So training a dog to do what they wanna do anyway, ain't really training??

    JS
    “Don’t wave your phony patriotism in MY face! If you really love America, open your wallet and hire an American kid to build what you buy. Think of all our problems that might solve.” Doug Fraser (paraphrased) 1980

    Real Americans buy American.



    Snowshoe's All American Guy SH, UDX, WCX ... CODY ... at the bridge
    CH. Snowshoe's Girl Crazy MH, UD, WCX, SDHF, OS ... PRESLEY
    ...​ at the bridge
    Millpond's Baby Boomer MH*** ... BABE
    Snowshoe's Crazy For Lovin You SH ... NELSON

  5. #115
    Senior Member polmaise's Avatar
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    When I say, "always", I mean "almost always".
    When I say, "never", I mean "almost never".
    One Shooter One Spaniel One Retriever

  6. #116
    Senior Member JS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by polmaise View Post
    Steve Schreiner wrote :"All will go when they want to.....But ..it takes a trained dog to go when they don't want to go.."
    In the spirit of the OP , I am having a problem understanding what this means?
    Psychologically if the dog is trained to go,surely it would want to go, whether it was trained to any programme? If it takes a trained dog to go when it doesn't want to go, then is it trained,or just compliant?..Just trying to get my head round the comment..I don't have to tell my dog's to sit ,they just do when I stop! So I take it they have learned to sit without being told!..They don't Go until I tell them to go! so they must have learned 'not to go until I say go.
    But when they ''don't want to go" ! is the OP's issue! ..So is the answer in the training of that dog and handler,not the dog.(irrespective of previous achievements) .
    Short statement that meant a lot 'Steve' Hope you don't mind me using your quote as an expression.
    Have you ever seen a 15+ minute water test?

    The dog is lining himself up on the mat for the last bird. He has swam 100+ yards twice to bring back the first two. The wind is 20 mph at a right angle. It is 40 degrees Fahrenheit. Maybe he has already run a water blind and 2 series of the Amateur today. This is a dog who wants a bird more than he wants anything else. He knows exactly where the bird is ... he looks out at it across 150 more yards of water. Maybe he gives a couple sideways glances. His ears may be laid back a bit.

    This is a good dog but there aren't enough cookies in the world to make him go after that bird. He wants it but ... maybe ... tomorrow???

    This is the time when you want your dog to know he goes when he hears his name whether it looks like fun or not.

    JS

    And he will be so proud of himself when he gets back!!!
    “Don’t wave your phony patriotism in MY face! If you really love America, open your wallet and hire an American kid to build what you buy. Think of all our problems that might solve.” Doug Fraser (paraphrased) 1980

    Real Americans buy American.



    Snowshoe's All American Guy SH, UDX, WCX ... CODY ... at the bridge
    CH. Snowshoe's Girl Crazy MH, UD, WCX, SDHF, OS ... PRESLEY
    ...​ at the bridge
    Millpond's Baby Boomer MH*** ... BABE
    Snowshoe's Crazy For Lovin You SH ... NELSON

  7. #117
    Senior Member cakaiser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JS View Post
    Have you ever seen a 15+ minute water test?

    The dog is lining himself up on the mat for the last bird. He has swam 100+ yards twice to bring back the first two. The wind is 20 mph at a right angle. It is 40 degrees Fahrenheit. Maybe he has already run a water blind and 2 series of the Amateur today. This is a dog who wants a bird more than he wants anything else. He knows exactly where the bird is ... he looks out at it across 150 more yards of water. Maybe he gives a couple sideways glances. His ears may be laid back a bit.

    This is a good dog but there aren't enough cookies in the world to make him go after that bird. He wants it but ... maybe ... tomorrow???

    This is the time when you want your dog to know he goes when he hears his name whether it looks like fun or not.

    JS

    And he will be so proud of himself when he gets back!!!
    Where's the like button..
    Charlotte Kaiser: " The Problem Lies In The Talent."

  8. #118
    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JS View Post
    Have you ever seen a 15+ minute water test?

    The dog is lining himself up on the mat for the last bird. He has swam 100+ yards twice to bring back the first two. The wind is 20 mph at a right angle. It is 40 degrees Fahrenheit. Maybe he has already run a water blind and 2 series of the Amateur today. This is a dog who wants a bird more than he wants anything else. He knows exactly where the bird is ... he looks out at it across 150 more yards of water. Maybe he gives a couple sideways glances. His ears may be laid back a bit.

    This is a good dog but there aren't enough cookies in the world to make him go after that bird. He wants it but ... maybe ... tomorrow???

    This is the time when you want your dog to know he goes when he hears his name whether it looks like fun or not.

    JS

    And he will be so proud of himself when he gets back!!!

    Thats when I want a dog that has two things you cant train for..HEART and COURAGE
    All my Exes live in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by lanse brown View Post
    A few things that I learned still ring true. "Lanse when you get a gift, say thank you and walk away. When you get a screwing walk away. You are going to get a lot more screwings than gifts"

  9. #119
    Senior Member JS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BonMallari View Post
    Thats when I want a dog that has two things you cant train for..HEART and COURAGE
    Courage: (1) The ability to do something that frightens one.
    (2) Strength in the face of pain or grief.
    Different topic, different thread, but I do think you can condition a dog to be courageous.

    JS
    “Don’t wave your phony patriotism in MY face! If you really love America, open your wallet and hire an American kid to build what you buy. Think of all our problems that might solve.” Doug Fraser (paraphrased) 1980

    Real Americans buy American.



    Snowshoe's All American Guy SH, UDX, WCX ... CODY ... at the bridge
    CH. Snowshoe's Girl Crazy MH, UD, WCX, SDHF, OS ... PRESLEY
    ...​ at the bridge
    Millpond's Baby Boomer MH*** ... BABE
    Snowshoe's Crazy For Lovin You SH ... NELSON

  10. #120
    Senior Member polmaise's Avatar
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    Never done a 15 minute water test! They usually come back with the bird quicker than that
    Done plenty of 6 hour retrieving days five days a week ,retrieving around 30 birds per dog per day ,most of them cripples. The last one was as quick as the first too!
    I believe you can breed courage ,but you can't install it though
    Slightly off topic ,but hey ,I thought it deserved a reply.
    One Shooter One Spaniel One Retriever

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