The RetrieverTraining.Net Forums The Retriever Academy
Total Retriever Training with Mike Lardy
Hawkeye Media Gunners Up Tritronics Gun Dog Broker
Page 6 of 9 FirstFirst ... 45678 ... LastLast
Results 51 to 60 of 90

Thread: New Breeder Question: Full or Limited Registration?

  1. #51
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    6,188

    Default

    Totaly agree with Sharon Potter. Limited Reg has become the norm, rather than the exception with Goldens (as Swampcollie mentioned).


    I do not charge extra for converting to full registration. However, clearances are not the only reasons for not wanting to see a dog bred.

    For conversions, I would advise breeders to sign the conversion papers & keep them in the litter file. If anything should happen to you, this will expedite things. The date can be added when needed. Same for any dogs you co-own.

    I rarely co-own dogs. Right now I just co-own one.

    Limited Reg is not infallible, but it can act as a bit of deterrent if you don't make a perfect judgment on a buyer. We are only human in making those judgments. Some people will not tell you the whole truth. Also, there are several "registries" out there that will provide anyone with a fancy pedigree certificate simply for a price. Pet buyers don't know the difference, so they equate any kind of "certificate" as equal to AKC.

    With Goldens one can look on k9data and find tons of obscure pedigrees ... from breeders who are one-timers and from those who turn their bitches into puppy machines for the cash; who know nothing about clearances ... and they eventually trace back to kennel prefixes that we recognize. So, I'd rather do everything I can to avoid my puppies ending up in such a situation.
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
    "Know in your heart that all things are possible. We couldn't conceive of a miracle if none ever happened." -Libby Fudim

    ​I don't use the PM feature, so just email me direct at the address shown above.

  2. #52
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    missouri
    Posts
    143

    Default

    I won't say I never will, but to date, I have not bought a limited registration pup. Had quite a discussion with a breeder that I wanted a pup from. I told him that he should not sell me a pup under any circumstances if he thought I was that irresponsible. I do understand the reasdon for LR, but I'm not doing it...

  3. #53
    Senior Member Jeannie Greenlee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    O'Fallon, MO
    Posts
    574

    Default

    I told him that he should not sell me a pup under any circumstances if he thought I was that irresponsible.
    I wouldn't sell a puppy to someone that I perceived as irresponsible, but I don't personally know most of my puppy buyers. It may be easy to "court me" and make me believe somethings that may not be necessarily true with the amount of contact that I have with someone before they buy a puppy. Limited Registration is my safety net. I just want to make sure people do the right thing before they breed a puppy that has my pedigree.
    Jeannie Greenlee

    Blazinlakes Legally Blonde CDX JH NAJ RA WC OD (1st Retriever)
    HRCH Smokingold Guns Up CCA WCX CD MH
    https://sites.google.com/site/smokingoldretrievers/home

  4. #54
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    owings mills, md
    Posts
    1,481

    Default

    I'm old school. I have never bought a dog with any type conditions placed upon my ownership(nor do intend to) and to be fair I don't pay attention to breeder guarantees.
    I have found it interesting that many breeders that do limited registration also insist on their kennel names being on the registration.
    As a buyer it is my responsibility to choose a breeder and breeding of quality, health and otherwise. As a seller I likewise have a duty to place puppies appropriately.

    JMO

    Tim
    You order a Lab; ask a Golden; but negotiate with a Chesapeake!

  5. #55
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,922

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Carrion View Post
    .
    I have found it interesting that many breeders that do limited registration also insist on their kennel names being on the registration.
    .

    JMO

    Tim
    I always found that interesting also. Seems their "noble concern for the breed" is matched by their selfish concern for publicity. In many cases the "noble" concern also serves an {unintended Im sure} purpose by limiting competition.

  6. #56
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,739

    Default

    I won't buy on Limited, aside from things happening to the breeder, when I get around to do health-screens and maybe thinking about breeding my dog. I just feel it questions my integrity, the care I give my dogs and my word. I can understand breeders wanting to protect their lines, and I will talk to a breeder with limited if they have an exceptional breeding, however if I cannot get the limited lifted; I'll move on to another litter. I've never had a problem getting it lifted, but hey if a breeder doesn't want to sell to someone with a history of actually working-campaigning their dogs, and is a shameless brag, too bad for them . I've bred 1-3 litters, I do not sell on limited, realistically if I ever got the feeling from a buyer that I'd have to consider limited registration, they don't need to be owning one of my pups. I'm pretty particular on where my pups go, but then I don't breed much, and I'm perfectly willing to train them up, until the proper fit comes around. Still with most buyers it's more of an issue convincing them not to spay-neuter until we see what the pups can do.
    Last edited by Hunt'EmUp; 05-01-2013 at 02:51 PM.
    "They's Just DAWGS"
    "Hunting is a skill to be learned whether you do it early or late it still needs to be learned"
    "I train dogs, Not papers"

    GMRH HRCH Quick MH (most importantly Duck/Upland Enthusiast)
    MHR HRCH Lakota MH (most importantly Upland/Duck Enthusiast)
    SHR Storm.. the Pup (Beginning Upland & Waterfowl Enthusiast)

  7. #57
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    6,188

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Carrion View Post
    I have found it interesting that many breeders that do limited registration also insist on their kennel names being on the registration.
    As a buyer it is my responsibility to choose a breeder and breeding of quality, health and otherwise. As a seller I likewise have a duty to place puppies appropriately.
    Tim
    Having the kennel prefix in the name will allow one to track back on pedigrees. If one of these non-registerable dogs should get into the breeding pool (and I'm sure that some do ... look at some of the newspaper ads to see this is entirely possible), we have some way to see who might have not been so honest. Also, some of these pups may still be talented dogs & get some AKC recognition, so why not be able to see that? Not every good home is cut out to be a breeder. Not every person who loves to train for obedience or field is ready to be a breeder, even if their dog(s) may be worthy of being included in the gene pool. So, if I place a dog in such a home, is it really awful for a breeder to want to have their kennel prefix given some PR?

    I only produce about one litter a year (sometimes less), but since 1979 I counted around 300 or so puppies in total. I've made some poor placements. I keep trying to learn from those mistakes. Those mistakes still bother me. I'm willing to try anything possible that might help offset any errors in judgment. We absolutely have a responsibility to "vet" buyers ... but we are not infallible. Falls into my theory that breeding dogs has a way of making one learn what humility feels like
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
    "Know in your heart that all things are possible. We couldn't conceive of a miracle if none ever happened." -Libby Fudim

    ​I don't use the PM feature, so just email me direct at the address shown above.

  8. #58
    Senior Member John Lash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Pittsburgh, Pa.
    Posts
    1,856

    Default

    Nothing against anyone in particular. It seems that selling with a limited registration is saying, "do as I say not as I do."
    John Lash

    "If you run Field Trials, you learn to swallow your disappointment quickly."

    "Field trials are not a game for good dogs. They're for great dogs with great training." E. Graham

  9. #59
    Senior Member Russ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    San Diego, CA & Ronan, MT
    Posts
    1,431

    Default

    I am another one that would not buy a pup with a limited registration. We have not bred our dogs, but if we decided to do so, I would not want to have to track down the breeder and get a full registration. People come and go in the retriever games, they move, etc. over a period of time.

    If the buyer does jump through the hoops, what is to prevent him/her from breeding to any untested bitch with an owner that is willing to come up with the stud fee. How many people look at the third generation of breeding and think ill of the kennel of the first generation? I do not think it is a factor.

  10. #60
    Senior Member Gerry Clinchy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    6,188

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by John Lash View Post
    Nothing against anyone in particular. It seems that selling with a limited registration is saying, "do as I say not as I do."
    Not trying to be a "wiseguy", but I'm not sure what you mean by this. If I carefully monitor my breeding program, I would like to see others carry on that practice with any dogs they may decide to breed that come from me. Actually, it's more like saying "do as I do". But maybe I'm missing something here.

    Going back to using the prefix, if the dog does pass all health exams, I like the idea that my prefix shows up all together on the OFA site. If anyone wants to check out the history of the bloodlines records (even after I'm long gone), they will have a good chance of finding that there are many dogs there. Most buyers who are educated enough might find that useful.

    How many people look at the third generation of breeding and think ill of the kennel of the first generation? I do not think it is a factor.
    There are many of us who look back even farther than three generations in a pedigree. Breeders can often point to dogs in the pedigree even farther back and give some pretty detailed information on those dogs.

    If the buyer does jump through the hoops, what is to prevent him/her from breeding to any untested bitch with an owner that is willing to come up with the stud fee.
    Absolutely nothing. Limited Reg is not infallible, but some of us feel it helps to emphasize the responsibility one takes when deciding to breed. At the very least, at the time of the "conversion", it gives us another opportunity to stress the importance of choosing mates carefully, and how much the breeder cares about the years they have invested in building the ancestry of the dog in question. I always offer to act as a sounding board to the owner for discussing the dog's possible mates, and give them whatever information I have collected from 30+ years of involvement in the breed.

    I'd hope that anyone with a pup from me would not have trouble tracking me down We should have kept in touch during the pup's life and shared its progress.

    I think we should also keep in mind, that the buyer is always free to say "no", and go to another breeder who will not require limited registration. Each breeder and each buyer has things they feel are "the right thing to do" from their own particular perspective.

    It also stands to reason that even breeders who use limited registration have a network of friends and fellow breeders whom they trust implicitly, for whom they don't feel the need to limit registration. When one is dealing with someone they have known very briefly, they are more cautious. Many of those on this forum are probably the kind of people who are NOT the kind of people who take the responsibility of breeding lightly. Anyone who has had a dog with health problems, or has died of cancer under the age of 10, understands the kind of responsibility that breeders take to heart ... even for those things that we really could not have anticipated, but because we know the emotional pain of losing a dog or seeing a dog in pain.
    G.Clinchy@gmail.com
    "Know in your heart that all things are possible. We couldn't conceive of a miracle if none ever happened." -Libby Fudim

    ​I don't use the PM feature, so just email me direct at the address shown above.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •