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Thread: YellowXChocolate=Blacks (???)

  1. #21
    Senior Member coachmo's Avatar
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    There's no telling what you will get from various breedings. According to several news outlets, George Zimmerman is a "white hispanic". Oh wait, wrong forum, sorry!!!!!

  2. #22
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jere View Post
    I don't know the answer to that - yet.

    Jere
    Try this best article I've found explaining the weird-interesting stuff
    http://labbies.com/genetics2.htm
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  3. #23
    Member Jere's Avatar
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    Default Bronze Lab. - a new color phase?

    Quote Originally Posted by coachmo View Post
    There's no telling what you will get from various breedings....
    The breeding: Black (no choc or yellow recessives) x Black (possible yellow recessive?) Dam and at least one full sibling may be similarly colored. This coloration is not season dependent.

    P140918013(640 x 480).jpgP140918009(640 x 480).jpgP140918017(640 x 480).jpg

    Jere

  4. #24
    Senior Member Hunt'EmUp's Avatar
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    Hmm that's an interesting one; I think you probably have an expression gene affecting your color. Tan points, brindle, perhaps a saddling effect usually only seen in the yellow coat coming out in the black coat. Happens every once in a great while, a genetic color test could probably find it.

    Labs having Tan Points

    Early breeding records indicate that a Labrador puppy with tan points on the ears, muzzle, and above the eyes (as found in the Doberman and Rottweiler) would occasionally be whelped to pure-bred Labrador parents. Breeders attributed this to previous interbreeding of Labradors with Gordon Setters during the early history of the breed. Because this trait was considered undesirable as a characteristic of the breed, breeders chose not to breed individuals expressing the trait in hopes of reducing frequency of its expression in future offspring.

    Today, it is recognized that tan points are controlled by the "at" allele of the A locus and that it is recessive to most of the alleles found at the A locus of Labs. Because this allele is recessive, it may be passed through many generations before a breeder is aware that the allele is present. In order for the allele to be expressed, a carrier would have to be bred to another carrier of this same allele and both parents would have to be carriers of the wild-type (E+) Mc1 receptor. This explains the low frequency of expression of this trait in the current Labrador population.

    or perhaps K gene variation
    http://labradornet.com/brindletanpoint.html

    Did you ever test? I'd be interested in the results. could be environmental but that is pretty red for sun-fade
    Last edited by Hunt'EmUp; 10-27-2014 at 03:53 PM.
    "They's Just DAWGS"
    "Hunting is a skill to be learned whether you do it early or late it still needs to be learned"
    "I train dogs, Not papers"

    GMRH HRCH Quick MH (most importantly Duck/Upland Enthusiast) Rip. July-2014
    MHR HRCH Lakota MH (most importantly Upland/Duck Enthusiast)
    HR Storm.. the Pup (Beginning Upland & Waterfowl Enthusiast)

  5. #25
    Senior Member firehouselabs's Avatar
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    All of my blacks had a reddish cast to their coats due to sun fade and when they were shedding out due to dead hair. No unusual at all.
    Raina Anderson WWW.FIREHOUSELABS.COM

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  6. #26
    Member Jere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hunt'EmUp View Post
    ...

    Did you ever test? I'd be interested in the results. could be environmental but that is pretty red for sun-fade
    I am thinking about it but want some input first, especially from the VetGen geneticist. Haven't found the price schedule for the full blown color tests yet either. I'm not sure I want to put lots of $$ into this quest. The "red" around the mouth is there always, the undercoat is red/brown? down to the roots.

  7. #27
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    That's called a k locus test from vetgen. $60 I believe.

  8. #28
    Senior Member ks_hunting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mwk56 View Post
    If you are a visual person, this site is great:

    http://www.blueknightlabs.com/color/coatcolor.html
    x2 for this site. I have been there countless times.

  9. #29
    Member Jere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ks_hunting View Post
    x2 for this site. I have been there countless times.

    That one is OK for the basic; black, chocolate, yellow color genetics. It doesn't cover the shades of yellow from white to fox-red, and other colors allowed by the AKC Standard, let alone legitimate but rare oddities. (What I mean by "legitimate" is that the gene form - alleles - which cause these rare oddities might be found in any Lab - black, chocolate or yellow; so the odd offspring are pure Lab - they just can't be shown in the show ring.)

    This site is better for off-color (pun intended) color genetics in the Lab.
    http://labbies.com/genetics2.htm

    Jere
    Last edited by Jere; Yesterday at 07:49 PM.

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