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Thread: Revolt Within The GOP

  1. #31
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franco View Post
    The Abortion Issue should left to the individual states to determine policy. If your state votes to ban them, the people have spoken. Just as within the Repub Party, Libertarians are divided on the issue yet agree that it should be left up to the individual states. Your selective edit of the platform makes it read like there is a conflict when there is not. In a Libertarian state there would not have been a need for the Saudi's to attack us. We were attacked for our dysfunctional Foreign Policy created by NeoCons and the do-gooders. The biggest Lobby in DC is by the Defense Contractors. Wars like Iraq, Vietnam etc made them very rich. We don't suggest turning the other cheek. However, our international efforts need a serious overhaul. To continue with the status quo, as some on this thread are advocating is the death of our nation. Empires do not fall from outside attacks or threats, the fall because of internal policies. The USSR didn't fall because of us, they fell because of their corrupt system, Ditto for Rome, Greece, Persia and others.
    Name 1 time people voted on and supported abortion in a general election (not SCOTUS).
    Never happened.............

    Same with gay marriage.
    The courts forced it upon us.

    Has nothing to do with what the people want.
    Last edited by road kill; 08-15-2013 at 01:59 PM.

  2. #32
    Senior Member Franco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by road kill View Post
    Name 1 time people voted on and supported abortion in a general election (not SCOTUS).
    Never happened.............

    Same with gay marriage.
    The courts forced it upon us.

    Has nothing to do with what the people want.
    I am 100% for letting the people decide the issue on a state by state basis!
    Last edited by Franco; 08-15-2013 at 02:56 PM.
    The Libertarian Party believes that all persons are entitled to keep the fruits of their labor. A call for the repeal of the income tax, abolishment of the Internal Revenue Service and all federal programs and services not required under the U.S. Constitution. We support the passage of a "Balanced Budget Amendment" to the U.S. Constitution, provided that the budget is balanced exclusively by cutting expenditures, and not by raising taxes. LP.org

  3. #33
    Senior Member GaryJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by road kill View Post
    Name 1 time people voted on and supported abortion in a general election (not SCOTUS).
    Never happened.............

    Same with gay marriage.
    The courts forced it upon us.

    Has nothing to do with what the people want.
    I agree. The SC is legislating from the bench.
    What if all we have today is what we gave thanks for yesterday?

  4. #34
    Senior Member BonMallari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franco View Post
    The Abortion Issue should left to the individual states to determine policy. If your state votes to ban them, the people have spoken. Just as within the Repub Party, Libertarians are divided on the issue yet agree that it should be left up to the individual states. Your selective edit of the platform makes it read like there is a conflict when there is not. In a Libertarian state there would not have been a need for the Saudi's to attack us. We were attacked for our dysfunctional Foreign Policy created by NeoCons and the do-gooders. The biggest Lobby in DC is by the Defense Contractors. Wars like Iraq, Vietnam etc made them very rich. We don't suggest turning the other cheek. However, our international efforts need a serious overhaul. To continue with the status quo, as some on this thread are advocating is the death of our nation. Empires do not fall from outside attacks or threats, the fall because of internal policies. The USSR didn't fall because of us, they fell because of their corrupt system, Ditto for Rome, Greece, Persia and others.
    totally agree with you on the statements highlighted in blue
    All my Exes live in Texas

    Quote Originally Posted by lanse brown View Post
    A few things that I learned still ring true. "Lanse when you get a gift, say thank you and walk away. When you get a screwing walk away. You are going to get a lot more screwings than gifts"

  5. #35
    Senior Member swampcollielover's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franco View Post
    The Abortion Issue should left to the individual states to determine policy. If your state votes to ban them, the people have spoken. Just as within the Repub Party, Libertarians are divided on the issue yet agree that it should be left up to the individual states. Your selective edit of the platform makes it read like there is a conflict when there is not. In a Libertarian state there would not have been a need for the Saudi's to attack us. We were attacked for our dysfunctional Foreign Policy created by NeoCons and the do-gooders. The biggest Lobby in DC is by the Defense Contractors. Wars like Iraq, Vietnam etc made them very rich. We don't suggest turning the other cheek. However, our international efforts need a serious overhaul. To continue with the status quo, as some on this thread are advocating is the death of our nation. Empires do not fall from outside attacks or threats, the fall because of internal policies. The USSR didn't fall because of us, they fell because of their corrupt system, Ditto for Rome, Greece, Persia and others.
    Franco....the Libertarian Party Platform says nothing about States controlling abortions! Your are the one being "selective', and I understand that as to follow this Libertarian thought, you have to kind of make it up as you go....you also failed to talk about all the failures of our Country that caused Pearl Harbor...and what about Hitler, I suppose you think his decision to exterminate 6 million Jews was due to all the bad things they have done in past....you see this Libertarian approach just does not hold water when you logically apply it to history. The USA's way of government is far from perfect, but it is the best ever developed....I agree it may fail from within, but the Liberal Marxist Democrats will be the ones taking it down while Republican RINOS, Tea Party Republicans, and Libertarians all stand around talking about it.....

  6. #36
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GaryJ View Post
    I agree. The SC is legislating from the bench.
    And the POTUS only obeys the legislation & laws he likes.
    He even ignores his own laws.

    Obamacare regards...........

  7. #37
    Senior Member swampcollielover's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mudminnow View Post
    Sorry to take it the wrong way swamp collie lover,... I was giving an example of what I think true conservatives think as opposed to the true modern conservative representation. I'll lay off the drugs

    What would a libertarian do after 9-11?

    I look at 9-11 as a culmination of our failures in the middle east. It is evident that we support folks to further our interest and label them as terrorists when we no longer need them. The roots of 9/11 can be seen back to the early 20th century when we went from non interventionists to imperial after WWII. Since then we have led many covert operations to overthrow governments and replace them with ones that are "on our side". Usually that is good in the short term for us but the long term effects can be seen in the post-9/11 foreign affairs. A libertarian would use 9/11 as evidence of the dangers of our foreign policy and would advocate a non intervention policy.

    Marvin, I like your critiques, they keep me honest. But I am not trying to pat my back because I think what I prefer politically is original. Cal me crazy but I believe there was a literal Garden of Eden, and guess what, there was no Govt. Then afterwards, he isrealites wanted government and God said "That's not a good Idea" but they kept asking and he said OK. What eventually happened was the destruction of the Nation of Israel after oppressive kings. So I realize my Idea of limited government is not original and in fact has never been an original man made idea in my opinion.
    Mudminnow....so you gave me your spin on 9-11, but you did not comment on Pearl Harbor, and what about Hitler exterminating 6 million Jews....your logic is a bit much to accept if you look at real life history instead of the nightly news and guys like Obama talking about how mean our country has been to others....

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by swampcollielover View Post
    Mudminnow....so you gave me your spin on 9-11, but you did not comment on Pearl Harbor, and what about Hitler exterminating 6 million Jews....your logic is a bit much to accept if you look at real life history instead of the nightly news and guys like Obama talking about how mean our country has been to others....
    so whats your take on 9/11, "them arabs just hate us cause we are 'mericans"? And that is the idea presented in the mainstream media and both democrats and republicans agree on that. Pearl Harbor was awful, I wish FDR had warned the base before the attack because he knew, its history. And history shows that FDR was just salivating over a war with Germany but the American public at that time did not want to fight another war. So instead of policies that promoted peace, he egged on the Japanese so they finally attacked us and viola, we had a reason for the war. So many people throw out the 6 million jews argument. Yes the Holocaust was awful, so bad in fact that I wish the Allies would have worked with the German resistance to overthrow Hitler in 1941 as opposed to having total war raged in Europe for 4 more years and millions of jews murdered. What did we do though when 10+million people were being murdered under stalin, what should we do about the genocide in Africa? What should be done about the hundreds of innocents killed by our drone strikes?

    Should we go to war every time a people group is oppressed? That's a better reason then what we have been using the past few wars.

    I love the idea of America and that is what my grandfather fought for in the pacific theater where he was shot at Okinawa. I believe that if he were still around though, he would agree that war is a racket and it tends to take advantage of the lower income classes.

  9. #39
    Senior Member Franco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swampcollielover View Post
    Franco....the Libertarian Party Platform says nothing about States controlling abortions! Your are the one being "selective', and I understand that as to follow this Libertarian thought, you have to kind of make it up as you go....you also failed to talk about all the failures of our Country that caused Pearl Harbor...and what about Hitler, I suppose you think his decision to exterminate 6 million Jews was due to all the bad things they have done in past....you see this Libertarian approach just does not hold water when you logically apply it to history. The USA's way of government is far from perfect, but it is the best ever developed....I agree it may fail from within, but the Liberal Marxist Democrats will be the ones taking it down while Republican RINOS, Tea Party Republicans, and Libertarians all stand around talking about it.....
    You may not be aware that Dr Ron Paul was the driving force behind today's Libertarian movement. "At the same time, Ron Paul believes that the ninth and tenth amendments to the U.S. Constitution do not grant the federal government any authority to legalize or ban abortion. Instead, it is up to the individual states to prohibit abortion." Swamp, exactly what is your question regarding Pearl Harbor and Hitler? The Libertarian approach holds the most water. Your Rebups and the Dems are arming Muslim extremist in Syria and Egypt! Tell me where that is in our best interest? The Libertarians aren't standing around, they are getting the message out, getting active in city, state and national politics. Political Revolutions do NOT occur over one or two elections. It takes time!
    The Libertarian Party believes that all persons are entitled to keep the fruits of their labor. A call for the repeal of the income tax, abolishment of the Internal Revenue Service and all federal programs and services not required under the U.S. Constitution. We support the passage of a "Balanced Budget Amendment" to the U.S. Constitution, provided that the budget is balanced exclusively by cutting expenditures, and not by raising taxes. LP.org

  10. #40
    Senior Member GaryJ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franco View Post
    You may not be aware that Dr Ron Paul was the driving force behind today's Libertarian movement. "At the same time, Ron Paul believes that the ninth and tenth amendments to the U.S. Constitution do not grant the federal government any authority to legalize or ban abortion. Instead, it is up to the individual states to prohibit abortion." Swamp, exactly what is your question regarding Pearl Harbor and Hitler? The Libertarian approach holds the most water. Your Rebups and the Dems are arming Muslim extremist in Syria and Egypt! Tell me where that is in our best interest? The Libertarians aren't standing around, they are getting the message out, getting active in city, state and national politics. Political Revolutions do NOT occur over one or two elections. It takes time!
    There and other places. Follow the money. Many things evil can be traced back to money. IMHO politicians get a taste of power and voila, it goes to their head. These same politicians sell their real or perceived power.
    What if all we have today is what we gave thanks for yesterday?

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