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Young dog trainers - when do you consider your swim-by complete?

4K views 10 replies 10 participants last post by  twall 
#1 · (Edited)
You're doing swim by and dog is casting well with bumper in mouth. Not able yet to stand in one spot and direct the whole drill but it's working fine with some handler movement up and down the bank.

Pup has given a refusal or two to enter water on an over cast and gotten corrected for it. Once corrected, she has auto cast into the water several times. Now, without me saying anything she will retrieve the side piles and immediately re-enter the water without being stopped and cast.

So, she clearly knows what we want (see water get in).

She's been forced into, across and back into the water. Direct pressure has been applied to the sit command as has indirect pressure. No adverse or unusual reactions to pressure.

Are we done yet, in your mind?

I know my personal answer but curious what the young dog PROS think.

Clue to my answer is... we did some easy channel blinds today and she did great, handling on the way out and back to stay in the water.
 
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#2 · (Edited)
When they can cast by you, across the pond, over the dike across the other pond, across the dirt road & up the hill with one cast and never think about stopping until you stop them. Then on the way back cast the other direction, cross in front of you, across the pond over the dike across second pond on the other side and up the other hill, one cast, never looking back and never think about stopping. In reality it's probably just when they'll carry the over cast for however long you want, never looking back and never think about stopping, but we got access to 3 ponds, a dirt path and two hills, so we use them ;)

P.S. take the time to address that auto-casting it will bite you in the buttocks later, not that I'm talking from personal experience or anything ;)
 
#4 ·
I love the auto cast...it tells me the pup understands what I'm asking....but does the pup really understand why?? Honestly, when I can initially send, stop, cast, and receive and NEVER move from that spot than IMO puppy understands what I'm asking. Then its done.
 
#8 ·
No, my question was what other people think/do with this part of the process. I'm always looking for ways to make my process more efficient. I value others opinion as I go along when I might be going to fast on a particular step.

I've been moving forward very quickly with this dog, knowing I can always go back and repeat/refine a step if the next one in the process shows a deficiency.

It seems to be working very well at 14 months but...

That doesn't mean I'm right. Credible opinions are always valuable and there are a few here.
 
#7 ·
I like to proof it in a new location by throwing out a bumper and asking for a swimby on the return. I have a long straight dam I have used for a couple of dogs. It may take a little extra work to generalize the behavior in a new location. I also do cast into the water drills and an occaisional swimby as maintenance. Mine seem to get sloppy over time and need a tune up now and then.
 
#9 ·
A direct answer; it's never done. It's a lifetime maintenance issue.

But it's complete when all its components are intact reliably. When you know you can stand at your baseline, knowing your dog will -

a. Go when sent
b. Stop when commanded - at least making a reasonable effort to tread in place (this is not nearly as tricky as some suspect)
c. Take each cast as given to completion, and...
d. Readily follow the swim-by command each time - again, to completion; not stopping or quitting until released by the handler (I use "okay")

That gets us out of the swim-by pond, and onward to larger bodies of water to expand on this skill, and to frame it in a real world context for the dog.

Evan
 
#11 ·
Darrin,

It has been a number of years since I have trained dogs for people.

From your description I would have considered the dog done and moved on. But, I'd have kept in mind that the dog didn't progress to the ideal goal of a one cast exit. It may never be an issue in the future. Or, it may need to be addressed in other ways in the future.

I think, with some dogs, staying on some drills too long is detrimental to the dogs training. And, can have impactson the dog for a long time.

I would err on the side of moving a little too quickly and go back if necessary.

Tom
 
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