Silver Labs In Hunting lines????????
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Thread: Silver Labs In Hunting lines????????

  1. #1

    Default Silver Labs In Hunting lines????????

    I am basically a show person. On another forum they are discussing silvers, ect..and how they are sold for big bucks , reg. as chocolates, a "designer mutt" mixed with Weims... have any field people out there seen this color in field lines ect.?? Just curious if its only "show lines" being exploited..

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    Senior Member ErinsEdge's Avatar
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    They usually have been field type conformation. Since they are most likely a mix of Weim and Lab they certainly don't have Labrador conformation ring qualities. Maybe someone is now trying to push them in a concocted English type but that won't fly for long.
    Nancy P



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    I've seen one in my area......6 mos. old, very, very short legs and tail, yellow eyes and an odd-shaped body......didn't seem to fit with the rest of the dog and even tho he still has some growing to do my guess is he will pretty much stay with this conformation--not a pretty dog in my eyes.

    Owner paid $2500 for him, bought him off the internet and there was really no health guarantee for anything. Dog came in with coccidiosis, has been diagnosed with kidney problems and also suffers from allergies. It's obvious the owner didn't know anything about dogs and because the people that breed these dogs set up such great-looking websites they suck in people who don't know any better. It's all about money--very sad state of affairs.

    Pat

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    Senior Member Uncle Bill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pat F.
    I've seen one in my area......6 mos. old, very, very short legs and tail, yellow eyes and an odd-shaped body......didn't seem to fit with the rest of the dog and even tho he still has some growing to do my guess is he will pretty much stay with this conformation--not a pretty dog in my eyes.

    Owner paid $2500 for him, bought him off the internet and there was really no health guarantee for anything. Dog came in with coccidiosis, has been diagnosed with kidney problems and also suffers from allergies. It's obvious the owner didn't know anything about dogs and because the people that breed these dogs set up such great-looking websites they suck in people who don't know any better. It's all about money--very sad state of affairs.

    Pat

    Your post should be circulated on every dog related BB. I can't tell you how this info delights me...not about the poor animal, and I assume that's what you meant by your "very sad state of affairs" comment, but about the saps that got taken for their stupidity.

    It's always confounding how folks with this much ignorance can accumulate all their money, that seemingly gets ripped off so easily.

    But hearing about them gives me a large dose of Schadenfreude.

    UB
    When the one you love becomes a memory, that memory becomes a treasure.

  7. #5
    Senior Member afdahl's Avatar
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    There are silvers bred and sold as field dogs. A couple of years ago I wrote an article on color genetics including mismarks, and as part of the research I spoke with Dr. Mark Neff at UC Berkeley, one of the researchers on the dog genome project. Dr. Neff has collected pedigrees of silvers born to unsuspecting breeders and he believes the data indicate that the gene has been in the breed for a long time.

    Dr. Neff told me that he didn't know if the gene was identical, at the molecular level, to the "blue dilute" gene that occurs in a number of other breeds, but that its effect on the pigment, causing it to be clumped together rather than evenly distributed, is the same. This gene, recessive d (the dominant, non-blue, allele is D) occurs in Dobermans and Weimaraners. The recessive blue coloration also appears in Newfoundlands and Chesapeakes.

    In a Dobe, dd in combination with B gives "blue," and dd in combination with bb gives "Isabella," which resembles a Weim or silverpeake (except it has tan points). I have not seen a silver Lab, but they are said to be bb (genetically chocolate) with the recessive blue dilute. I'm also told that there are black Labs showing the blue dilute, which are described as "cast-iron" colored. These would correspond to a blue Dobe.

    Dilution appears not to affect the yellow-red pigment, so it is not apparent in yellow Labs. If you had a yellow Lab that was bbddee, based on the color of my Chesapeakes, I would expect it to have a grayish colored nose, but normal-looking yellow coat.

    The earliest account I have found of possible "silver" Labs was a description of "bluish-white" puppies whelped in Scotland in 1932. "Bluish-white" is a pretty good description of the color of a newborn silverpeake--and I'm guessing the puppies in Scotland didn't live long enough for anyone to see what the color turned into.

    To review:
    -A professional canine geneticist who has studied silver-Lab pedigrees, submitted confidentially, concludes that the gene has been in the breed a long time

    -The gene is easily overlooked, even when dd is present, because its effects are very subtle in yellows and blacks (Note that chocolates, in whom the dd combination is apparent, weren't bred in large numbers until recently.)

    -A gene with the same effect is present in both known related breeds, Newfoundland and Chesapeake

    -The appearance at birth of Chesapeakes with the silver coloration fits the description of Labs whelped as far back as 1932.

    IMO the evidence that the silver color is inherent to the Labrador breed is strong. In my very personal opinion, I'm happy people are breeding silver Labs, and that the AKC accepts their registrations. So many people want to be different, and get a dog that is different, and they get one of the other retriever breeds or a Boykin or Toller or something else--all of which have their merits, but people come to grief expecting them to act like Labs. The Labrador is the only Labrador.

    Amy Dahl

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    The last I knew the Labrador Retriever Club did not recognize silver, and neither did the AKC.

    When did AKC start registering silver Labs?
    --Vickie Lamb
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    Administrator Vicky Trainor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vickie Lamb
    The last I knew the Labrador Retriever Club did not recognize silver, and neither did the AKC.

    When did AKC start registering silver Labs?
    According to the AKC website, they aren't......only black, yellow & chocolate are eligible for AKC registration.

    Vicky
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  10. #8
    Senior Member afdahl's Avatar
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    AKC registers them as chocolate.

    Amy Dahl

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    Senior Member Julie R.'s Avatar
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    My sister has a silver Lab she got as a rescue, shown with 2 of my CBRs below. Kelly looks more field type but if you saw a picture of her standing, she also looks like she has some Weim in her. She is a sweet dog and a nice pet for my sister, but she's had lots of health problems. No retrieve desire and doesnt' particularly like to swim. She's also skittish and in the wrong hands I think she could easily have been a fear biter. Compared to my SilverPeake she also looks more blue, like her coat is dilute black compared to his dilute brown coloring. She has a gray nose and yellow eyes. I believe the original owners paid big bucks for her and she's the product of a brother-sister breeding.


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    Senior Member achiro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Julie R.
    My sister has a silver Lab she got as a rescue, shown with 2 of my CBRs below. Kelly looks more field type but if you saw a picture of her standing, she also looks like she has some Weim in her. She is a sweet dog and a nice pet for my sister, but she's had lots of health problems. No retrieve desire and doesnt' particularly like to swim. She's also skittish and in the wrong hands I think she could easily have been a fear biter. Compared to my SilverPeake she also looks more blue, like her coat is dilute black compared to his dilute brown coloring. She has a gray nose and yellow eyes. I believe the original owners paid big bucks for her and she's the product of a brother-sister breeding.

    OOOOH, so now we know where those silver 'peakes came from.
    "The thing I admire about the rat tail is that it takes commitment. It's not like one day you just decide you want one, you have to grow out that bad boy and you have to repeatedly convince the hairdresser to trust you because it's a great idea."

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