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Thread: The Wildrose Way

  1. #31
    Senior Member HuntinDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desiree View Post
    People standing in a field in white coats and dogs looking for birds in front of gunners are not part of the WRW program. The guy states in his book that he does not train dogs to meet competition criteria. If you want to be successful in field competitions or hunt tests (like most folks on this forum), then you need to choose a program that will help you meet those goals. Train with the end in mind. WRW will not get you to a MH/FTCH.
    I agree with much of what you wrote. However, about the part I've quoted above - my observations of the poor results of the mildtoes way (whether trained by the professionals themselves or the amateur) had nothing to do with white coats and there were no white coats present at the hunt tests and club training sessions at which I made those observations. It was a matter of dogs refusing to pick up retrieving objects. It was a matter of dogs who were not prepared to do the work.

    Like most on here, I would not choose to train a dog without an e-collar but I've done it (a nice hunting dog) and it can certainly be done better than I did it. But to choose a system that does not include Force Fetch is folly unless your standards are exceedingly low.
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    "When you go to a test or a trial, your dog should be underwhelmed." ~ Evan Graham

    "It is unreasonable to expect a dog to be more precise than you are." ~ Rex Carr

    "You own what you condone." ~ Mike Lardy

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  3. #32
    Senior Member Rick Hall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HuntinDawg View Post
    But to choose a system that does not include Force Fetch is folly unless your standards are exceedingly low.
    Damba, my standards must be exceedingly low - but please don't tell my dogs. They've worked tough beats well without knowing they needn't bother.
    If you think I'm wrong, you might be right.

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  4. #33
    Senior Member Tim West's Avatar
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    I have guided a group of hunters for five or six years, which included Mike Stewart and his dog Deke. The group had eight in it, and probably five or six Wildrose dogs. I can attest that Deke, Rebel and several others were dogs anyone would want to hunt with, as they were steady to shot, market well, and ran blinds like they had been shot out of a cannon. I have the Wildrose Book (not the tape) and I can see that it could get the job done. One of Wildrose's methods is to get he trainers back to Wildrose for training sessions, which I would think help the owners get help on issues and of course to get some inspiration.

    I have not used the Wildrose way to train my dogs because my goal is to run in AA stakes, but if my goal were to have a nice dog that will hunt and be a good citizen, I don't think this program would be out of consideration. Do your homework, then pick a plan or seveal parts of plans. I cannot slam the Wildrose dogs from what I have seen over many hunts, both field and water.
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  6. #34
    Senior Member captainjack's Avatar
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    I've tried the Wildrose Way and I've tried Lardy's TRT. Regardless of your goal, TRT is my recommendation. Much more thorough.
    Glen Guider, GA
    HRCH UH Candlewoods Captain Jack Sparrow MH QA2
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    Red Squad's Randall Raines "Memphis"

  7. #35
    Senior Member DarrinGreene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desiree View Post
    Someone recently posted about a QAA dog that didn't handle hunting in a flooded rice field well. I don't think that it's part of the QAA training program. I recall the dog got better with more experience and will become out to be a great hunting dog.

    People standing in a field in white coats and dogs looking for birds in front of gunners are not part of the WRW program. The guy states in his book that he does not train dogs to meet competition criteria. If you want to be successful in field competitions or hunt tests (like most folks on this forum), then you need to choose a program that will help you meet those goals. Train with the end in mind. WRW will not get you to a MH/FTCH.


    I think the question is more do you want to use an ecollar program or not. With WRW no ecollar is used unless it's necessary and no FF.

    According to WRW "the ecollar is used as a problem solving tool of absolute last resort and then only one single command is reinforced..blah blah blah! As soon as you begin using the ecollar the process has already begun to get rid of it. It's a temporary step only..blah blah blah..it is preferred to hunt a dog without any type of correction tool or collar, since the collar can become entangled, proving hazardous to the dog."
    This approach appeals to some people.

    In most ecollar based programs the collar is always on the dog, both in training and hunting. And FF is the norm. This approach also appeals to some people.

    If your planning on getting a ecollar then choose a program that will take you through it's proper use. A lot of folks seem to like Hillman right now. Good Luck! And have fun with your pup!!!!!
    When it comes to this philosophical argument over whether or not to use an e-collar or any other tool in dog training I've come to the conclusion over many many dogs that there's what works, and what people sell to those who have emotional issues with what works. With a retriever at the distances we expect, even for a hunting dog, there is absolutely no substitute for the tool, period end of story. That's simply the truth and there's no getting around it. The truth doesn't care if you like it or not and it won't change to suit your fancy. All that said I GUARANTEE there's something in the WRW that an experienced trainer can put to use. The issue is - do you want to pay for the DVD and watch the whole thing for the one idea or concept that may be of use to you when you have more than enough information at your fingertips with Lardy, Graham, Hillman and Mertens?
    Darrin Greene

  8. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by HuntinDawg View Post
    I agree with much of what you wrote. However, about the part I've quoted above - my observations of the poor results of the mildtoes way (whether trained by the professionals themselves or the amateur) had nothing to do with white coats and there were no white coats present at the hunt tests and club training sessions at which I made those observations. It was a matter of dogs refusing to pick up retrieving objects. It was a matter of dogs who were not prepared to do the work.

    Like most on here, I would not choose to train a dog without an e-collar but I've done it (a nice hunting dog) and it can certainly be done better than I did it. But to choose a system that does not include Force Fetch is folly unless your standards are exceedingly low.


    The comment about white coats referenced the program I'm currently using.

  9. #37
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    Once again, Darrin Greene for president!

    And something else to remember is that unless you are Lardy, Farmer, Burns and so on, it's extremely difficult to train your dog to that same standard (think Lottie as an example) for the program that individual developed. The Wildrose dogs that were named were probably trained by Stewart, which will produce a better product than an ametuer. Moreover, since the majority of clubs and groups use an e collar based program, finding support amongst peers and local mentors will be rough.
    -Mike

  10. #38
    Junior Member Roffey's Avatar
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    I'll send you a free wildrose training a gundog book you pay shipping.

  11. #39

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    Thanks to everyone for the advice. I will look into all of the suggestions and make a decision that I think will work best for me.

    EYL

  12. #40
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    I saw on Facebook one time that Evan Graham was especially a big fan of Wild Rose

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