I'm not tired - But I do need to get something off my chest:)
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Thread: I'm not tired - But I do need to get something off my chest:)

  1. #1
    Senior Member Big Chief's Avatar
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    Default I'm not tired - But I do need to get something off my chest:)

    Ted started a thread about being tired of many things including the lack of what I would call elevated discourse. I chimed in with a post that I have been thinking of starting a thread with. It is cut and pasted from Ted's thread. Take it for whatever it is worth, but I would wager it reflects the sentiments of many people who frequent this forum, but are intimidated to join, much less start a thread and ask questions...

    "I will say this. I am new to retrievers. I run my dog in hunt tests. I will likely never run my dog in field trials because of time, money, choices etc... I would hazard to guess that I am as committed to my dog and train as hard, and consistently as you folks who run field trials at the highest levels, though I will make many mistakes, likely on a daily basis. I have thrown birds at both trials and hunt tests to gain experience and learn. I have read just about every single post over the last few years so I can learn and do well by my dog. I try my best to have thick skin, and will ask questions when I encounter problems and need answers.

    What I will say, and you can flame me all you want, is that there are a number of elitist, first class arseholes on this forum who obviously think their feces don't stink. They are what I call "Equal Opportunity Arseholes" who talk down to people who are at their level, who may be new to the sport if they ask what some may consider an obvious or elementary question, if they only run hunt tests and not field trials, or just want a good hunting dog. I say that, fully acknowledging that the incredible dogs in field trials are the pinnacle of canine athletes, and do things that make you just shake your head in awe.

    Last I checked though, this forum is called Retriever Training Forum not Field Trial Training Forum. If you want this forum to just be a small little circle jerk of people that dies a slow death, carry on. If you want more people to join your sport, try becoming an encouraging person who is willing to help out even with questions that have become repetitive or simplistic.

    Mike Lardy and Danny Farmer were new at one point too, and if this forum were around when they started, they probably would have seemed annoying with all their questions. Why? Because they wanted to learn all they could. Just remember that the next time you are tempted to talk down to someone.

    From a personal standpoint, I am thankful for the many kind, helpful people who have offered me their advice both on the threads I started, and via pm, including the OP of this thread (Ted)."
    Last edited by Big Chief; 02-29-2020 at 03:45 PM.

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  3. #2
    Senior Member labsforme's Avatar
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    Take a breath and relax. I think what was being spoken of as intelligent discourse had not so much with trials etc but in general people offering advice as if they had the knowledge to do so and were off base. Training a trial dog,HT, or just hunting dog has certain fundamentals that apply in general. The trial people here and most I have met do not merit the description you give. There are poor sports in all games.Including just hunting. I agree this forum is for dog training but we have lost much because so many give "internet" advice when the solution is not simple.

    Best to you and yours

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    Senior Member Tobias's Avatar
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    What I find disheartening, is that probably many potentially good relationships/friendships could be had, if it were not for the judgmental insults and passive aggressive comments made.

    Everyone who's been on RTF for any length of time 'ought' to know the pen is mightier than the sword. Meaning, nuance, etc... all get lost, to some degree, in translation. Everyone walks in different shoes... thank goodness!
    The way I look at it, every dog is an opportunity to be a better trainer, and every day is a new day to be a better trainer to the same dog we trained yesterday.

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    Senior Member EdA's Avatar
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    I stopped responding to training threads many moons ago. There were far too many posts allegedly requesting help when all they really wanted was to filibuster and present their opinions. If I had wanted to debate I would have gone to POTUS which I quit reading even longer ago. I don’t think I was the only one so affected. As to Mr. Farmer he did start as proposed but learned very quickly the shortest distance between 2 points which at that time was Monroe LA where he lived to Shreveport LA where Judy Weikel (Aycock) winter trained.

  7. #5
    Senior Member Tobias's Avatar
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    And honestly.... there are VERY few training questions even posted any more.

    Puppy training and occasional line manner issues.

    Bryan Park's 'flyer' thread and the 'hunting on the way to the blind' thread. Both with good information and different points of view.
    The way I look at it, every dog is an opportunity to be a better trainer, and every day is a new day to be a better trainer to the same dog we trained yesterday.

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    Senior Member DarrinGreene's Avatar
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    The world is full of trainers with 30 years experience who resent those with 15 years experience having anything to say that doesn't agree with them.

    Check out Fakebook if you doubt me.
    Darrin Greene

  9. #7
    Senior Member Big Chief's Avatar
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    Thank you for your responses. It was not any of you I was referring to. In fact, I believe all of you have shared your wisdom with me on more than one occasion, and for that I am grateful.

    What I am saying is this, as often as not, when a person asks a question, the thread devolves into a you know what match because people don't agree with the advice someone else gives, and the OP's question gets lost in the process. I see it all the time. People invariably say why even bother.

    Some have opined that the age of competitors is getting older. I would suggest that making this forum an inviting place by the way in which questions are answered would be a step in the right direction.

    Just a thought.

  10. #8
    Senior Member Backcast's Avatar
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    One reason there may not be a lot of training questions, and I say this with a lot of first hand experience, is the Search feature. I'm an amateur running Master tests and if one of my training partners or I have an issue I go right to the RTF Advanced Search field and read every post I can on the topic. I usually find my answer but this practice hampers interaction on the site and could cause me to miss a new idea someone has on a topic. But to Big Chief's point, I have seen some condescending replies to innocent questions so the Search field has become a preferred option.

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    Well, I’m the exact person that you are referring to.
    I’ve always had labs and I’ve been a horse trainer and I’m an equine vet tech and I worked as a rehab vet tech in the past.
    When I got my new pup, I started thinking that I might want to do some hunt tests with him. I thought it would be fun.
    I enrolled him in puppy obedience classes and have been watching training videos and I have been reading posts on here.
    I happen to be about an hr away from three different clubs which is a bit too far to be a regular thing.
    Between the clubs being far and the unwelcoming feel on these boards, I’m beginning to feel like never mind, it’s too much to over come.
    I’ve wanted to post my “ I’m a beginner where do I start?” thread but have felt it wouldn’t really be well received. That might be just my feeling but there it is.
    OP I’m right there with ya.

  12. #10
    Senior Member road kill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qandbennsmom View Post
    Well, Iím the exact person that you are referring to.
    Iíve always had labs and Iíve been a horse trainer and Iím an equine vet tech and I worked as a rehab vet tech in the past.
    When I got my new pup, I started thinking that I might want to do some hunt tests with him. I thought it would be fun.
    I enrolled him in puppy obedience classes and have been watching training videos and I have been reading posts on here.
    I happen to be about an hr away from three different clubs which is a bit too far to be a regular thing.
    Between the clubs being far and the unwelcoming feel on these boards, Iím beginning to feel like never mind, itís too much to over come.
    Iíve wanted to post my ď Iím a beginner where do I start?Ē thread but have felt it wouldnít really be well received. That might be just my feeling but there it is.
    OP Iím right there with ya.
    There are many folks here who will, and have, reached out to help "newbies."
    What geographical area are you in.

    I PROMISE if you give it a chance you will have a new addiction!


    Watch for some threads coming about training drills to a specific fundamental.

    If you have a question, ask it.
    Yu are smart enough to figure out who & what to listen to and not.
    The dog games are like anything else when people are involved.

    All the Beast!!!
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    So what is big is not always the Trout nor the Deer but the chance, the being there. And what is full is not necessarily the creel nor the freezer, but the memory, the MOMENT." ~ Aldo Leopold

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