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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Everyone,

First post here. I'm a newbie at this. I'm sure you all know how to deal with this. I have a Boykin Male, about 14 weeks. Treat training and transferring to the leash, etc. is going well. Basic obedience is going well. Sits (on whistle), stays, comes (on whistle), place, kennel, beginnings of heel (understands to follow) all going great for treat and beginning leash, choke collar training. He brings the puppy bumpers back no problem! He Has started swimming and bringing those bumpers back. Loves feathers, etc.

So today I decided to try a simple fresh dove retrieve. (neighborhood cat killed it). I figured I would start to introduce dead birds in the yard and the field soon. Well, needless to say the dove put that dog on another level, fired up about it. I showed in the bird, he got laser focused. (he has his check cord on) I tossed it out 10 yards in the backyard. He charged it, grabbed it, I gave him the three whistle toots, and had to drag him back to me where he proceeded to clamp down on that dove. I got stern, then praised him tremendously, then had to drag the dog and bird into the house to grab a treat to have him let go. Bird is totally mush at this point.

Help? Please? I'm happy about his tremendous desire to gets birds! That was only the first, but I certainly don't want to reinforce the behavior over and over again with more birds. Thoughts.

Don't want to make a miss-step with the second and third birds.

Best,
Matt
 

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Many dogs will eat a dove. Don't know why. This was a handler mistake. Don't use doves for training. Wait a bit and try a pigeon or small duck. Everything will be fine.
PS. Since you know she is birdy, no need to rush back into birds.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Gotcha. Doves seemed to be perfect sized for this little guy. I like to eat doves. I was going to work on trying to find some pigeons, frozen and/or alive. Anyone have any idea where to obtain in Baton Rouge, LA?
 

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After she has gone through the transition phase, she will probably retrieve doves fine. Oops, he not she.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Yeah, I figured it was me not accounting for something. By transition phase you mean dealing with dead and live birds? Thanks so much for your advice!
 

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After she has gone through the transition phase, she will probably retrieve doves fine. Oops, he not she.
From budgie to Badger ?
A retrieve is a retrieve !
I thought you guys done ff ?
Maybe this thread is for the birds .
 

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Doves are such a tasty little morsel...I've seen several dogs gulp on down...GONE!! except for a couple feathers.

Pigeons....are there any highway overpasses around there? Go at night with a flashlight and a fishing net.....pigeons are pretty easy to catch. Fun!!
 

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Yeah, I figured it was me not accounting for something. By transition phase you mean dealing with dead and live birds? Thanks so much for your advice!
Transition is part of most retriever training programs, the transition from basics to advanced training. Way beyond dead and live birds. Wayne's correct in pointing out your dog passed the birdyness test in spades. Now that you know birds are not a problem with your dog, I would just use bumpers until after force fetch.
 

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Transition is part of most retriever training programs, the transition from basics to advanced training. Way beyond dead and live birds. Wayne's correct in pointing out your dog passed the birdyness test in spades. Now that you know birds are not a problem with your dog, I would just use bumpers until after force fetch.
I agree...
In addition... see the forest through the trees....slow down.... bond...trust...very important...
My penny
 

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From budgie to Badger ?
A retrieve is a retrieve !
I thought you guys done ff ?
Maybe this thread is for the birds .
14 weeks is WAY too early to FF a pup. Doesn't even have its adult teeth yet. Not sure if you're serious or in the fire water again.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
14 weeks is WAY too early to FF a pup.
What does FF mean? What retriever training programs would you suggest? Lardy DVDs? I've read water dog of course, but have really been following Tom Dokken's Retriever Training Book -- The Complete Guide to Developing Your Hunting Dog. Any advice to continue along would be great. Thanks in advance.
 

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Go to Mike Lardy's website. He has a free down loadable flow chart that shows the steps in basics, transition and advanced. I would suggest you buy Volume 1 of Lardy's Retriever Journal articles ($30). It defines and describes the steps in basics. For instance explains force fetch.
I will stop here and let someone familiar with Boykins pick it up.
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
OK I got it. "FF" is force fetch. Sorry just did not understand the abbreviation. Yeah, no one ever said I force fetched trained the dog yet. That is WAY too early. Just used a bird, that's all. Thanks, Wayne.

Wayne, on the flow chart I'm still in the "Socialization and Intro to Field" Section, and I know it. Not sure how this got off track to FF and so on. We are simply exploring and taking it all in. That's all. Thanks guys!
 

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OK I got it. "FF" is force fetch. Sorry just did not understand the abbreviation. Yeah, no one ever said I force fetched trained the dog yet. That is WAY too early. Just used a bird, that's all. Thanks, Wayne.

Wayne, on the flow chart I'm still in the "Socialization and Intro to Field" Section, and I know it. Not sure how this got off track to FF and so on. We are simply exploring and taking it all in. That's all. Thanks guys!
We're just looking down the road a ways. It was good to test your pup with a bird at this age. Some dogs aren't that interested in retrieving or birds, so we test them. Your dog passed with flying colors, so we can check that box off.

You might try a larger bird that the dog can't swallow whole, and see if you can entice the pup to bring the bird to you. Some lucky guys get pups that naturally bring you the bird, most pups this early in training want to keep that prize for themselves. Right now you don't have any tools built in the dog to deal with that, so if your dog doesn't want to come back right now, I would hold off on the birds until you are having him return with the bumper to ingrain that habit. Much later, maybe six months, you can force fetch, or better yet, have an experienced trainer FF, then you'll have the tool to deal with proper delivery of the bird.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
We're just looking down the road a ways. It was good to test your pup with a bird at this age. Some dogs aren't that interested in retrieving or birds, so we test them. Your dog passed with flying colors, so we can check that box off.

You might try a larger bird that the dog can't swallow whole, and see if you can entice the pup to bring the bird to you. Some lucky guys get pups that naturally bring you the bird, most pups this early in training want to keep that prize for themselves. Right now you don't have any tools built in the dog to deal with that, so if your dog doesn't want to come back right now, I would hold off on the birds until you are having him return with the bumper to ingrain that habit. Much later, maybe six months, you can force fetch, or better yet, have an experienced trainer FF, then you'll have the tool to deal with proper delivery of the bird.
John, thanks so much. I appreciate the response. That really helps a lot and keeps it all in perspective a bit. I think I need to broaden my materials a bit from Dokken and take the next few months to really work on that bumper retrieve habit. Really build the desire to return the bumper.
 

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Sorry I missed your call. I found a letter that you sent me many months ago! :cool:

I hope to catch up with you this evening.

Chris
C'mon, fellow RTFer Mr. Atkinson, take thy leave from the Boykin dove-inhaling thread for a relevant advert;-) before the dog's completely ruined:2c::


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MG
 

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I've long kept a loft of roughly 30 homers, but once a wee pup like yours has shown that he likes birds (which yours has), he'll not get his lips on another until good retrieving habits have been well established with bumpers.
 
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