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Watched most of it and what she said was common sense that I think many on here already embrace.

Now if I could speak with the British accent....well the opportunities would be endless.


Love the bouncy Cocker. He could probably pass the Grand.
 

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That was excellent! Thanks so much for posting that link! Love the British methods! Love how steady and attentive the dogs are despite so much distraction and despite all of the other dogs working at the same time! And all with treat and toy and clicker training!! It can be done!

I have a now 2 yr old Golden male with his JH and well on the way to SH trained completely with these methods and it's such a joy to train and succeed. He is my first retriever to train for gun sports, and i'm doing it mostly alone due to my remote location, so it has been slow, but very satisfying.

Jennifer
 

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That was excellent! Thanks so much for posting that link! Love the British methods! Love how steady and attentive the dogs are despite so much distraction and despite all of the other dogs working at the same time! And all with treat and toy and clicker training!! It can be done!

I have a now 2 yr old Golden male with his JH and well on the way to SH trained completely with these methods and it's such a joy to train and succeed. He is my first retriever to train for gun sports, and i'm doing it mostly alone due to my remote location, so it has been slow, but very satisfying.

Jennifer
The only thing I didn't like about the video is she kept saying this could be done without harsh or negative pressure like if you don't use the clicker or treats, you beat your dog. This is entirely not true. I would venture to say most GOOD trainers use attrition and positive reinforcement instead of constant negative or harsh methods.


Dogs looked fine but guarantee they were trained in that environment.
 

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The only thing I didn't like about the video is she kept saying this could be done without harsh or negative pressure like if you don't use the clicker or treats, you beat your dog.QUOTE]

Or maybe that's the way you chose to interpret it. I didn't take it that way.
 

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I don't know if that's what this lady meant, but there is no question in my mind that the perception is out there that people with e-collars just walk around shocking their dogs into submission. I know I pretty much thought this until I educated myself on the topic, and then I still had to win my wife over on it. We were talking last night about the ways our life had changed since we got our pup about a year ago, and one of the things she said was that she was really worried about the collar. She now knows that I really try not to use it unless it's necessary, and sometimes it is.

People still look at me a little funny sometimes when I am out with my dog and they see the collar and transmitter, but I am learning to ignore it. They probably don't know any more about it than I did before I fell into this dadgum dog addiction.
 

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I don't know if that's what this lady meant, but there is no question in my mind that the perception is out there that people with e-collars just walk around shocking their dogs into submission.
Given that the use of e-collars is virtually unknown in mainline UK training, I doubt that Phillppa was referring to it.

Eug
 

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I don't have anything against e-collar trainers and know first hand that they aren't all about negativity and punishment. It's just that I don't like most power tools, they intimidate me and make me afraid that if i make a mistake with them, it's likely to be a big mistake. I often use a regular screw driver vs a power screw driver for that very reason.

So, for me, love seeing others have success with treats and clickers!

Jennifer
 

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Lessons need to be taken from how the trainers in the U.K. train their dogs, after all, isn't that where the field trials came from?
 

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And to "Gulf Coast", I'm going to try to prove it to you in the next two years. I'm about to get a new pup with top notch ped out of Stanley Steamer, with TNT Explosion "Boomer" as grand dad. We're going for MH with all positive. If that works, I'll hit the FT scene. Keep you posted.

With respect to all of you,
Jen
 

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The only thing I didn't like about the video is she kept saying this could be done without harsh or negative pressure like if you don't use the clicker or treats, you beat your dog.QUOTE]

Or maybe that's the way you chose to interpret it. I didn't take it that way.
To each their own.
 

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isn't that where the field trials came from?
Sure, but it isn't where they've gone to.

I train as near to positive only as I can, and get a fair result. However Trials in the US have developed along with the e-collar in something like symbiosis. There isn't (IMO) a realistic chance given the present state of knowledge, of competing at the highest level in US Trials without a collar.

This is not to imply that collar training is in any way "better" than the modern alternative; just a recognition that the necessary P+ corrections at distance can't be given any other way; and without such means, the Trials would not have developed in the way that they have. In simple terms Trials in UK are a test of gamefinding; Trials in the US are a test of retrieving. Both are equally valid.

Eug
 

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Sure, but it isn't where they've gone to.

I train as near to positive only as I can, and get a fair result. However Trials in the US have developed along with the e-collar in something like symbiosis. There isn't (IMO) a realistic chance given the present state of knowledge, of competing at the highest level in US Trials without a collar.

This is not to imply that collar training is in any way "better" than the modern alternative; just a recognition that the necessary P+ corrections at distance can't be given any other way; and without such means, the Trials would not have developed in the way that they have. In simple terms Trials in UK are a test of gamefinding; Trials in the US are a test of retrieving. Both are equally valid.

Eug
Well said Eugene
 

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I have all the respect in the world for Janice and know how she and John train. They've been incredibly successful. She mixes both methods and is an awesome lady! We have been in contact a few times and yes, she has been to the annual Clicker Training Expo, a three day, several hundred person event.

That said, going down the positive only path will never turn out to be the wrong path for me and my hunting, sporting partner. No NFC or MNH title will change that for me and my specific journey. As I said earlier, I have great respect for those who succeed and enjoy whatever other methods they use.

Jennifer
 

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I have had a gentleman in my area who trains English Cockers. If I'm not mistaken his cockers run at the national level. He subscribes to this method of training: the soft voice commands, no real pressure, and total relaxation. He has given many pointers over the years and every time problems have been solved or averted. I don't feel that toys are such a big deal but then again I just hunt and do not field trial. I liked video good for Phillipa! It works for her.
 

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We're going for MH with all positive. If that works, I'll hit the FT scene. Keep you posted.

With respect to all of you,
Jen
If you can do it, more power to you. It will be extremely difficult and very doubtfull you will make it to MH using nothing but positive.
Good luck.
 

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Jhenion

Wow....all these positive and encouraging words from some!!!!!!!!!!!

Go get 'em and keep a positive attitude and hold your head up high, you can do it. I plan to do it,and I use a cane for walking.
 
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