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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Last year during a training day I watched closely to see the bumpers the dawgs would pick up in order. Now again remember I did say GDG but noticed on that particular day that the bigger % were Flagman canvas over Dokkens by almost two to one? Today after recently buying some Neuman & Bennet bumpers training by myself with one dawg and an equal amount of Bumpers to DFT again it was at least two to one from the lining piles! Just a simple observation on two isolated days that probably mean nothing but I sure wish I would have saved "my" money for even more reg bumpers! Anyone else mix the two and notice a prefference either way?
Peake - OK let the slander law suit begin! :lol: (*This is a Joke*)
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dogs

I think that it is all plastic to the dogs. DFT are more for the owners than they are for the dogs. It may fool a dog the first time but any intelligent dog will quickly figure out that it is not the real thing. I agree, better off buying a half-dozen good bumpers.
 

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Not GDG Peake. Sounds like a scientific study to me. I haven't used them for pile work but I think I'll start my own research program and I'll let you know the results.
I think my dogs prefer the Dokkens. They carry them better with less dropping. I've noticed that with young pups during the transition period going from puppy bumpers to full size ones seem to carry the Dokkens much better. At first with the full size bumpers they will drop them 3 or 4 times on the return but not the Dokkens. This of coarse is pre-force fetch. Dokkens also prevent the cigar hold which really is no big deal except that the dog doesn't have a good hold and can drop the bumper especially if he steps on the rope.
I have a theory about this. Full size bumpers seem to seal off thier mouth and prevents them from breathing like they should even more so after a few retrieves and especially in young smaller dogs with a small mouth thus the tendency for the cigar hold to get more air in thru the side of the mouth.
The Dokkens however being somewhat flat or oval shaped and curved seem to allow them to breath better.
I don't use Dokkens for pile work where you need lots of them, way to expensive. I only use them when training alone and throwing out of my wingers. In this situation unless I'm using real birds it's Dokkens all the way. 3 or 4 of them is all you ever need.
Some think they resemble decoys too much and will teach pups to retrieve decoys. I don't buy that at all. My dogs are smart enough to learn the difference quickly, but then I don't have those phunny brown dogs with yeller eyes. :lol: :lol: :lol:
 

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I have a couple Dokken mallards and, if mixed in a pile, my dogs will pick them up first. I'm convinced, however, that it's just some random factor in the way they were introduced that make the dogs think they are more fun. I've seen other dogs that prefer something else and pick the Dokkens up LAST. After all, if the dog is properly forced, he will pick up anything and it is a waste to worry about "what HE likes".
I do think they have a value that I have never heard anyone else mention ... they LOOK more like a duck in SIZE and SHAPE in the air and I believe they help a dog in that respect. Better for developing depth perception in marking real ducks. Does anyone consider this a value?
JS
 

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JS said:
Does anyone consider this a value?
JS
Yes, I have. Folks that know me know that I have tossed thousands of ducks as a BB. Other than the DFT having a head, I see no real difference and some disadvatages with ther DFT in the air. First, I think that the way the bird looks in the air as compared with a DFT is different and that the dogs can distinguish between the two. When using real dead ducks, I think the wing action is more important than the head. DFT have no wings. Ribbons are no substitute for the white underside on a pen-raised Mallard wing. For long marks I like to use the color bumper that best suits the background. Sometimes white bumpers and other times black. I think that they are easier to see at a distance over a DFT. I've also seen pre-FF pups carrying DFT by the head, I'd rather use small bumper with no rope attached. Most pups by 11 weeks old can handle a small bumper well and I don't have problems with them holding bumpers when teething.
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
....OR it could be some factor much simpler with those that do preffer bumpers IF their bright White (or Black & White) it visually has to jump out quicker to a dawg that is anxious to get back to the line faster and not shop?
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I have a few DFT's, but use them only in a few isolated cases.

HOWEVER, my simple scientific study has concluded that on pile work, when mixing white and orange bumpers (say 15 of each at a pile), dogs most always bring back more white than orange... Some dogs seem to clear the pile of white before grabbing an orange. I suspect it's partly because, at that stage of training, they really only have experience with white bumpers (used in puppy marks in some cases). They really don't see orange bumpers, in my world, until yardwork and only when they start pile work. That's my hypothesis and I'm stickin to it!

-Kristie
 

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When Keith Stroyan and I train, all of our dogs seem to like the Bumper Boy throw bumpers the best (we do too!), followed by DFT and then bumpers. Of course REAL ducks rule!! (Even ducksicles!) :)

--Nicki
 

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I have a couple Dokken mallards and, if mixed in a pile, my dogs will pick them up first. I'm convinced, however, that it's just some random factor in the way they were introduced that make the dogs think they are more fun. I've seen other dogs that prefer something else and pick the Dokkens up LAST. After all, if the dog is properly forced, he will pick up anything and it is a waste to worry about "what HE likes".
I do think they have a value that I have never heard anyone else mention ... they LOOK more like a duck in SIZE and SHAPE in the air and I believe they help a dog in that respect. Better for developing depth perception in marking real ducks. Does anyone consider this a value?
I only have 2 dokkens --full-sized mallard, and a diver teal.

my dogs prefer them to bumpers.

I think they are help for depth perception, and they throw more like a real duck from a winger.

Plus, their size is helpful --more like carrying a real duck.

finally, they can be scented. (although, I do have a few scent bands for my standard bumpers, and that works fine too.)--i use scent on my camo and black bumpers.
 

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Never used the DFT and no need for me to start. My pup goes bonkers as soon as I touch a bumper.
 

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My dog is crazy about either, but if you have Dokkens & bumpers on the blind pile she'll go for the Dokken's first.
Kristie-it's funny you mention color because on blinds Kate always brings back the black bumpers first.
I probably won't invest in Dokkens because I always have birds in the freezer & there's no question that anything else is secondary.
M
 

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Strange choices...

I have one dog which has a fairly unique prefrence.

Can make a pile out ef every type of bumper, one of each dokken and include a real duck, pigeon, chukar or anything else you can think of.

The dog will retrieve the very large dokken goose first every time.

Andr
 
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