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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My buddy is looking at a repeat breeding for a YLF. The breeder e-mailed him a couple of pictures of the sire and dam and also a picture of what appears to be a 6 to 8 month old pup from the 1st litter. The pup seems to have droopy eyes, almost more like a hound look where the lower part of the eye lid hangs down and you can see the red inside the lid. Neither the sire or dam have the same look. Is this a puppy thing that the pup will grow out of or is there reason for concern. I can see this being a real hassle for a working dog.

Danny
 

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I've got a pretty hard running male that spends a TON of time in the field. he's got droopy lowers, but when he's working he 'tightens' them up - never had any more trouble with him than any of the other dogs in terms of getting pollen/seeds etc in his eyes..
 

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I've got one that has the droopy eyes, he gets eye infections more often than my other too. He does have more allergies than the other two, so that could possibly be a cause of the eye infections as well. Other than that, there are no other problems.

Pete
 

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I had one and he grew into them meaning, when he developed a nice head, the eyes didn't droop. You wouldn't believe the diifference between puppy pics at 7 weeks and adult. He is out of LeanMac




 

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My brothers dog had something along the same line. His eye sockets were too big or something to that nature. The vet did minor surgery, not a bad cost and cleared it right up. They are right he had to wait until after the pup was done growing. He looks real good now and doesn't have much trouble in the field. Dust was a killer on that poor guy!!! It's not a genetic thing or a major problem. He's was the only puppy like that I know all the dogs for the 3 generations and no problems there as well. Something that happens :?
 

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Don't think that problem as described is Horner's Syndrome (that seems to be human condition) -- believe that this is what is known as ectropion -- I had this problem to slight degree with my BLM -- decided to have surgery to correct (nip and tuck) -- was costly -- over $2500 and he popped sutures over right eye after a week (vet used a "crazy glue" type of liquid suture and this seems to have worked) -- but I had it done because he's running FTs and didn't want to risk any problems with possible irritation of eye from seeds,etc. -- he looks great now -- eyes are fine -- sometimes will grow into as well
 

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ducksoup said:
Don't think that problem as described is Horner's Syndrome (that seems to be human condition) -- believe that this is what is known as ectropion -- I had this problem to slight degree with my BLM -- decided to have surgery to correct (nip and tuck) -- was costly -- over $2500 /quote]

That is what the condition is called and i believe is considered hereditary

Dogs with ECTROPIAN eyes have a greater chance of getting infections,and foreign objects in them while afield.I have seen this in a slight condition and some so bad you could pitch dimes into them.

I am not sure but i do not believe a dog can be CERF'ed with ECTROPIAN eyes.

I would not spend money on a puppy knowing i will need to do surgery in a few months.
 

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Genetic

I understood antropian and entropian was genetic,One the lids droop out,one the lids fold in.I dont know which one is which.The later is more a problem as the lids actually irritate the eye.The droopy one can be fixed by a little tuck and a couple of stiches......but ....can be passed on.can someone refresh us all on this subject?
 

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Lil Dikens Kennels said:
That is what the condition is called and i believe is considered hereditary
Dogs with ECTROPIAN eyes have a greater chance of getting infections,and foreign objects in them while afield.
I am not sure but i do not believe a dog can be CERF'ed with ECTROPIAN eyes.
I bought a very well bred bitch once and bred her to 2 different studs. I kept a pick pup from both litters and each developed Ectropia (one more severe than the other). Their mother had this condition very slightly and was hardly noticable (and she CERF'ed).

My opthamologist saw the pup I kept and said "I can't CERF that one".
I will probably discontinue that line (on my quest to produce the perfect dog :D ) as I don't want to continue producing Ectropian dogs.
 

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Entropion (rolling in) I believe is inherited like hip dysplasia-it's polygenic-multiple genes that interact. I had a female develop it late (around 4-5 months) and I fixed her lids and had her spayed. I would not keep a dog with entropion for breeding. Ectropion is where they droop and it may improve as my example did above. I was advised to not do anything about it until he was older by the breeder and I'm glad I didn't. He CERFed.
 

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Dogs with ectropion can be CERFed -- would I breed my dog ??? yes, since he is clear re eyes and if hips clear (he's CNM clear as both parents were clear and on white list) -- ectropion is not necessarily severe and pup can grow out of (as previous post stated) -- my BLM had surgery because I chose to do so -- he could've run trials without any problems without surgery -- just thought it would be safer to do so
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Thanks, for the info. I passed it on and will let my buddy contact the breeder and make a decision.

Danny
 

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I was told by the Opthamologist at IA State University that if have a dog with droopy eyes be sure to breed to a dog that does NOT have droopy eyes. It is inheritied. Dog was CERF'd at ISU.
 

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Yes, you can get a CERF # but it should list the :

Breeder Option Diagnosis

Category A
Eyelids:
Entropion
Ectropion
Distichiasis
Ectopic cilia
Eury/Macroblepharon

That way you will know what you are dealing with and make an informed decision.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
My buddy opted out of that litter and will look elsewhere. While I'm on the topic, he will graduate from college in late spring and is looking to get a YLF from some solid field lines. Although he has hunted all his life this is his 1st dog and he will be training it himself. If anyone is planning a nice litter that will be ready to go late spring / early summer please PM me and I"ll pass on the info.

Thanks, Danny
 
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