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What do you think about John Fallon's idea that field trials should go for FOUR DAYS?

  • Love it! John Fallon rules! I vote for John as Master of the Universe. Sign me up to judge, work, a

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  • I'm on board as soon as I win the lottery

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Discussion Starter #1
Ok, let's see what people think about John Fallon's idea that field trials should go for FOUR DAYS.
 

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But until I win that lottery, lets keep it to 3 days. After I win the lottery I'll hire Shayne to run the things and I'll just show up with my pro and run. :p
 

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Most working people that run field trials leave to travel to the trial on Thursday afternoon right after work. Drive 3-8 hours ,take a vacation day for Friday, hopefully are leaving to get home on Sunday afternoon when the fourth series is over. Drive 3-8 or more hrs home and go to work on Monday wore out! Thinking in their mind I can win this coming weekend if we will challenge the blind a little more and work on that short retired gun.
Four day trials are not practical for the majority. Most clubs are understaffed on Friday running the derby and open because not enough club members want to take a vacation day to work. Granted some retired early with tons of money and time on their hands. I'm not jealous of those of you that were that fortunate, I'm proud of you. But most of us don't have that luxury. I love FT as much as any of you, wish I could go to one every weekend but that is not practical for my family or my pocket book.
You have got to love America, Land OF Opportunity!
Chad Baker
 

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In my business, it wouldn't bother me to take four days. BUT I AIN'T GONNA DO IT!!!!!

There's more to life than retrievers.

Jerry
 

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Ted,
First of all ,I would like to commend you on your on the biased, factious wording of your poll :!:
?.and yes I meant to use factious and not facetious (thats what I am being ,commending rather than condemning) ,as your wording, while inappropriate was not meant to be humorous rather it was meant to polarize the factions in the poll .
Also the third question did nothing but detract from the accuracy of the poll.
But you of course knew that would be the case!
The fact that very few FT Pros(the ones that would be effected most by restricting the entries) frequent and/or post on this board will also undoubtedly skew this poll

Over the last year and one half I have come to expect nothing MORE from you .

That the Field Trial would possibly go four days only in the Open with over 89 entries and then probably only for those(mostly pros at this point) who made it to the water (marks?), somehow conveniently escaped the verbiage of your poll.

I for one after driving 3, 8, or even 10/12 hrs, want to be given a good solid testing/judging situation rather than the slash and burn pencil whipping that goes on now when judges are faced with large numbers.
Your alternative ,Limiting the Competition, By making the OPEN something something less than open is of course an option but it is not the one that I prefer.

Furthermore, that the amateur running an Am, with entries over the threshold of 69 entries and starting on Friday because of this, would have to make provision to see that their dog was run, to my way of thinking, is not a justifiable issue, since, this would have no more impact on their lives than the amateur running his own dog in a Derby or "Q" that starts on Friday. This is done as a matter of course.

Also when the numbers dictate the Derby and "Q" should be given resources, that is to say, the time and dedicated judges required to fairly and adequately test the dogs.
john
 

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Gun_Dog2002 said:
Seems interesting that two people with less than popular solutions to a growing problem would take "cheap shots" at each other like this. Especially when that behavior has been discussed....

http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7746&start=30&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=


/Paul
Paul .
I concur in your assessment of the poll and Shayne's assessment of Ted's attitude of those who unlike him have not had their day in the sun.
As depicted by a quote from the first post on that thread

Shayne Mehringer wrote:
Ted... if i were you (and clearly i'm not, i'm much better looking)... i would just say "I'VE FINISHED A NATIONAL AND YOU HAVE NOT, SO KISS MY ASS!!!!" That should end the discussion pretty quick.



The Poll is, in and of itself , by virtue of the wording, a cheap shot at me.
I do not see where I reciprocated in kind.
The problem will not just go away .
All of the solutions will have a varying degree of popularity.
I just hope that the one picked ,will be picked because it is the best one ,rather than that is the most popular, as that could be mutually exclusive ,but maybe not.
john
 

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john fallon said:
I just hope that the one picked ,will be picked because it is the best one ,rather than that is the most popular, as that could be mutually exclusive ,but maybe not.
john
John,
Can you please explain the above statement? I would think that the most popular option would be the best because it benefits the most folks or at least harms the fewest...
Seeking enlightenment as they say...
Thanks,
Tina
 

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KJB said:
john fallon said:
I just hope that the one picked ,will be picked because it is the best one ,rather than that is the most popular, as that could be mutually exclusive ,but maybe not.
john
John,
Can you please explain the above statement? I would think that the most popular option would be the best because it benefits the most folks or at least harms the fewest...
Seeking enlightenment as they say...
Thanks,
Tina
Tina,
It just seems to me that the more dogs that get the opportunity to run the blinds(most good least harm) the better it is for all involved.
First series judging as we now have at large opens do not allow for this.
This is not usually the case for the blinds.
This is a function of time for the most part as the cut to a managable level has already taken place on the marks.
Now you can gain TIME by restricting the entries .
The litany of problems that this will cause has been posted elsewhere,help being one of the big ones if the club members that normally help can't run there dogs.
Or ,you can allow all who wish to run,run, and all but the few that are successful that weekend to go home when they would normally do so.
I prefer the latter and all the club members that wish to can run there dogs.
Here again as in restricting the entries "Help" can be the fly in the ointment, but all of the other suggestions also have some flys .
John
 

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john fallon said:
Paul .
I concur in your assessment of the poll and Shayne's assessment of Ted's attitude of those who unlike him have not had their day in the sun.
As depicted by a quote from the first post on that thread

Shayne Mehringer wrote:
Ted... if i were you (and clearly i'm not, i'm much better looking)... i would just say "I'VE FINISHED A NATIONAL AND YOU HAVE NOT, SO KISS MY ASS!!!!" That should end the discussion pretty quick.
Hey goober... i was telling Ted that is what he SHOULD say... as opposed to his attempt to logically debate something.

4 day trial is a BAD BAD BAD idea. Amateurs would not be able to run and pros would never have time to train.

Shayne
 

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Shayne Mehringer said:
john fallon said:
Paul .
I concur in your assessment of the poll and Shayne's assessment of Ted's attitude of those who unlike him have not had their day in the sun.
As depicted by a quote from the first post on that thread

Shayne Mehringer wrote:
Ted... if i were you (and clearly I'm not, I'm much better looking)... i would just say "I'VE FINISHED A NATIONAL AND YOU HAVE NOT, SO KISS MY ASS!!!!" That should end the discussion pretty quick.
Hey goober... i was telling Ted that is what he SHOULD say... as opposed to his attempt to logically debate something.

4 day trial is a BAD BAD BAD idea. Amateurs would not be able to run and pros would never have time to train.

Shayne
Shayne
Thanks for straightening that out :wink: Buttttttt.....
Without regard as to why you said it .
You sure hit the nail on the head.
As that is his attitude or at least it would seem so.
In a nutshell Ted thinks that it is unfair that the pros get so many chances to run the same test, and he only one or two, and is steadfastly against any resolution of the problem that does not address this concern.

Because, our society is interested in having fair competition and eliminating unfair competition.

Those on the board who compete in field trials - and not just me - have repeatedly expressed the competitive advantage that comes with running large numbers of dogs in a stake.

All stakes with the possibly exception of the Open will be finished on Sunday, hence very little or no problem for most of the field, the amateurs in particular, with the exception of a few of the "A" list.
The "rank and file" amateur with a shot at an AA placement that can't stay and run the water marks :roll:
Only the pros with dogs in the last series would need to stick around ,and the alternatives posted elsewhere with regard to pro run dogs ,have more dire consequences than missing a day of training.
I only can hope that in rebuttal Ted can argue the merit or lack thereof of the forgoing posts rather than to resort to more personal attacks
john

PS-As of this post 9 different people posted but 28 voted which means 19 voted without giving us the benifit of a better idea :wink:
 

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4 days of field trials.......uuuuugggghhhhhh :x

certainly the pros wouldn't mind, most take Monday off anyway, my business does not consider Monday an off day

it's not for me or for my small group of dedicated friends who already labor 6 to 8 thankless days a year
 

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Ed Aycock said:
4 days of field trials.......uuuuugggghhhhhh :x

certainly the pros wouldn't mind, most take Monday off anyway, my business does not consider Monday an off day

it's not for me or for my small group of dedicated friends who already labor 6 to 8 thankless days a year
I think the pros WOULD mind. 4 days at a trial, 1+ day for travel, 1 day off, and 1 day to train = 7 days.

As it stands, I don't know how some pros run tests/trials and also accept young dogs for basics.

Shayne
 

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John wrote:

All stakes with the possibly exception of the Open will be finished on Sunday
John must think that no one works on Thrusday or Friday.

Or if he means start the trial on Friday and go to Monday with the Open -
two problems:

1. Some of us "poor Amatuers" run Opens and do get a piece of the action. My last dog had just as many Open points as Am points.

2. I wonder who would be arround to throw birds for all these "pros" on Monday?
 

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While 4 day trials might allow for more dogs to play longer, I know that as a worker at FT's, I am exhausted by day 3 and just want to go home. I suppose if my dog was still in the Open going into day 4 I might be rejuvenated... :wink:

Just snuck a peak at the entries for TX Panhandle. 31 entries already in the Open :shock: 18 are Farmer, 12 are Schrader. Sure am glad I volunteered to marshal the qual :D
 

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Shayne Mehringer said:
I think the pros WOULD mind. 4 days at a trial, 1+ day for travel, 1 day off, and 1 day to train = 7 days.

As it stands, I don't know how some pros run tests/trials and also accept young dogs for basics.
Shayne
I think the Pros would be OK with it staying just the way it is.
If it were a choice between the Rex Carr Rule- let the clients run the dogs
or maybe having to hang around and run on some Mondays and make $12/1500 while you were at it :wink:
How do you think they would vote?
If a low limit ,say under ten, were put on the number of dogs one person was allowed to run
How do you think they would vote?
Getting away from the Pros .
How many existing clubs would vote for conflicting trials resulting in a loss of revenue or running a RESTRICTED that a lot of the member help would not be able to run and in doing so create a help problem for the entire weekend
Your idea of a new club with conflicting dates ,if it would ever happen ,might work for one or two of the problem trials in your immediate area, but does nothing to solve the problem in general.
john-wondering who is going to throw the birds on Fri Sat and Sun of a restricted
 

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If trials went to four days, I guess I'd have to run more hunting tests and play more golf.... :roll:

Keith Griffith
 

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Before I started to work I would have seen nothing wrong with 4-day trials. Now I would have to take not 1 but 2 days off. Depending where the trial would be held. Just think your pros would only have 2 days to train during the week if they had to travel.
 

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john fallon said:
john-wondering who is going to throw the birds on Fri Sat and Sun of a restricted
Are you actually suggesting that it would be easier to find help in a four day trial than in a restricted 3 day trial?
 
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