[Tim West]

Is there anywhere that updates the Derby points on dogs other than FT News two or three months late?

From the 06 list it would appear that Hawkeye's Seawolf has a lock on the race this year, but I have not heard of any other dogs than have racked up enough points to challenge him.

How many does Seawolf have now and who are his closest competitors?

Tim

 

[John Gassner]

I don't know of any other sources for more timely updates.

If by lock you mean any other dog with a nice pedigree being run by an experienced pro that campaigns almost exclusively with a dog or two and almost exclusively to be the high point derby dog and to run all over the country and run whichever of the several events that this dog is simultaneously entered in that have the best odds....then yes, I think it's a lock.

 

[mpage]

derby

How does anyone compete against a dog that has already run 40 derbies? I dont have the dog or the money. I did run one a couple of weeks ago and had a blast. Lot's of fun. Good people and saw some good dogs.

 

[Guest]

I don't know of any other sources for more timely updates.

If by lock you mean any other dog with a nice pedigree being run by an experienced pro that campaigns almost exclusively with a dog or two and almost exclusively to be the high point derby dog and to run all over the country and run whichever of the several events that this dog is simultaneously entered in that have the best odds....then yes, I think it's a lock.

Wow, I never heard of the multiple entering of events. Really? I guess that's one way to do it... wow

 

[Goldenboy]

I don't know of any other sources for more timely updates.

If by lock you mean any other dog with a nice pedigree being run by an experienced pro that campaigns almost exclusively with a dog or two and almost exclusively to be the high point derby dog and to run all over the country and run whichever of the several events that this dog is simultaneously entered in that have the best odds....then yes, I think it's a lock.

I noticed that as I was going through Entry Express. Probably a wise business plan, and it is a business plan. I'd like to see the ROI on this one.

 

[Guest]

I don't know of any other sources for more timely updates.

If by lock you mean any other dog with a nice pedigree being run by an experienced pro that campaigns almost exclusively with a dog or two and almost exclusively to be the high point derby dog and to run all over the country and run whichever of the several events that this dog is simultaneously entered in that have the best odds....then yes, I think it's a lock.

I noticed that as I was going through Entry Express. Probably a wise business plan, and it is a business plan. I'd like to see the ROI on this one.

Definately a business plan and, even with that, still a title that would be well-earned in the end. and I assume the non-entered clubs are $60+ richer.

 

[K G]

Who owns the dog now?

kg

 

[Bayou Magic]

Re: derby

How does anyone compete against a dog that has already run 40 derbies? I dont have the dog or the money. I did run one a couple of weeks ago and had a blast. Lot's of fun. Good people and saw some good dogs.

Unless one follows the same system, it would be very difficult to compete even with a very talented pup. I’d love to have the time and $$$ to run NutCase all over the country. A little more training time wouldn’t hurt either. I think she could be a thorn in any dog’s side.

Here’s a dumb question. Is high point dog based on the total points a dog earns even if some of those points are earned in the previous calendar year?

Frank

 

[jeff t.]

I don't know of any other sources for more timely updates.

If by lock you mean any other dog with a nice pedigree being run by an experienced pro that campaigns almost exclusively with a dog or two and almost exclusively to be the high point derby dog and to run all over the country and run whichever of the several events that this dog is simultaneously entered in that have the best odds....then yes, I think it's a lock.

I noticed that as I was going through Entry Express. Probably a wise business plan, and it is a business plan. I'd like to see the ROI on this one.

Definately a business plan and, even with that, still a title that would be well-earned in the end. and I assume the non-entered clubs are $60+ richer.

Unless they cancel at the last second.

I'm impressed how some handlers are willing to run a derby on Friday at one trial, then travel 10-12 hours to another club's derby the next day. Getting 2 derbies in one weekend!

Jeff

 

[Guest]

I don't know of any other sources for more timely updates.

If by lock you mean any other dog with a nice pedigree being run by an experienced pro that campaigns almost exclusively with a dog or two and almost exclusively to be the high point derby dog and to run all over the country and run whichever of the several events that this dog is simultaneously entered in that have the best odds....then yes, I think it's a lock.

I noticed that as I was going through Entry Express. Probably a wise business plan, and it is a business plan. I'd like to see the ROI on this one.

Definately a business plan and, even with that, still a title that would be well-earned in the end. and I assume the non-entered clubs are $60+ richer.

Unless they cancel at the last second.

I'm impressed how some handlers are willing to run a derby on Friday at one trial, then travel 10-12 hours to another club's derby the next day. Getting 2 derbies in one weekend!

Jeff

crazy!

 

[golden boy 2]

What rock have you been living under?

He's running a 32 dog derby on fri in memphis and an 18 dog derby in Kingman KS on Sat.

 

[Franco]

Re: derby

Is high point dog based on the total points a dog earns even if some of those points are earned in the previous calendar year?

Good question. Use to be based on total points earned in a Derby career, then changed to calendar year when it became the Purina High Point Derby dog. That is my understanding but, like I told my Pro yesterday when I delivered my 7 month old to him, "I don't care if we run any Derbies, I want this dog QAA'd by 20 months and ready to run AA by 30 months" :wink: In this game, asking and receiving are often two different thangs.

 

[Steve Amrein]

I know this has been kicked around before but I had a chat last weekend with some folks that quit running after the make the derby list. I know more dogs that have done well in the derby racking up a bunch of points only to never recover from it and go on to jack squat. BTW not that my opinion counts as my personal dogs are doing squat right now

 

[Miriam Wade]

Steve Amrein wrote:

racking up a bunch of points only to never recover from it

Steve (anyone)-can you elaborate on this? My pup has only run 2 Derbies (out in the 3rd in both ), but I've been told not to concentrate on Derbies that he should be training for beyond.

What is the danger in running Derbies for some dogs as far as hurting their chances at excelling in Quals or All Age work? Is it the risk of becoming trial wise & "loose" or not getting teh foundation they need for "big dog" blinds & marks?

VERY Curious Regards-

M

 

[Jerry]

There's an owner from this region that won the Hi Point award by double entering the dog on several weekends and running back and forth to both. If he had a questionable job in one, he would just blow it off and concentrate on the other.

The handler of the #2 dog, who was also from this region, was only a couple points behind with a relatively limited number of entries.

And this was YEARS ago, so it's not anything new.

Jerry

 

[Lyle Harne]

Steve wrote:

I know more dogs that have done well in the derby racking up a bunch of points only to never recover from it and go on to jack squat.

This topic has gotten a lot of discussion. Here's the top 25 for this decade. I would say more excellent All Age careers than not.

HAWKEYE'S VIKING 92
HAWKEYE'S COAST GUARD 2003 NDC 84
HAWKEYE'S RED WHITE AND BLUE 84
VOLWOOD'S PEACHES & CREAM 83
TAYLORLAB DOWNTOWN DUSTY BROWN 72
RUNNING WITH THE DEVIL 61
LITT;E BIT DANGEROUS 60
CAROLINA'S ACOUSTIC STORM 58
WATERMARK'S TEXAS WELCOME 56
BRITTANY LAKES SOLID AS A ROC 55
CROPPERS TESS PILOT 53
CLUBMEAD'S ROAD WARRIOR 53
DIXIE CITY JAM II 53
CAROLINA'S ELECTRIK GYPSY 53
DEJA BLEU 53
TRUMARC'S LEAN CUISINE 53
ARAN ISLANDS DOUGAN 50
CONTENDERS DORA 50
MOON SCHOON QUICKS SURESHOOTS 48
HIWOOD JAGUAR 47
RUNNIN'S MOLLY B 46
MAD RIVER'S MAGGIE MCBUNN 46
PLOURDE'S IDES OF MARCH 44
ZIP IT UP 44
PIKE OF CASTLEBAY 41
I guess it depends on how many points are a bunch.
Lyle

 

[Jerry]

If Qweezy had cheated a little on Ed and not tried to go through that dam biggo thorn bush on the last bird of the 4th series, she would have had another 1st.

Jerry

 

[Jason Brion]

Steve Amrein wrote:

racking up a bunch of points only to never recover from it

Steve (anyone)-can you elaborate on this? My pup has only run 2 Derbies (out in the 3rd in both ), but I've been told not to concentrate on Derbies that he should be training for beyond.

What is the danger in running Derbies for some dogs as far as hurting their chances at excelling in Quals or All Age work? Is it the risk of becoming trial wise & "loose" or not getting teh foundation they need for "big dog" blinds & marks?

VERY Curious Regards-

M

I currently have a dog running derbies. She certainly hasn't been entered in anything near 40. And is not going to be threatening any of the high point dogs. However, this is my take.

The marks that you will see are getting to the point that it is nearly impossible for the young dogs to have seen them/ trained for them before. They are approaching AA marks. In fact. One of the marks at last weeks derby in KS was identical to the one ran in the open (this was the shorter go bird).

With this being said. I see a lot of things go uncorrected in hopes of a ribbon. I'm guilty as well. Cheating and going back to old falls are a major problem. If allowed to cheat during these test what are we truly accomplishing? Probably not much. And only time will tell how much were hurting them. Is the ribbon really worth it? Wouldn't we be better off using the time to train?

 

[Matt McKenzie]

Lyle,
I think your post effectively debunks the myth that a dog with a bunch of derby points is less likely to be a successful all age dog. Sometimes the facts can ruin a very compelling argument. :lol:

 

[Steve Amrein]

I am not saying that dogs with high numbers of wins cant or dont go on to AA titled dogs. I am just 1 guy but I could name 5 or more dogs that had great derby runs with 20+ points that are not following the same path as did their previous derby career. So to end my portion of the discussion on this topic is just cause you have a good marking derby dog does not ensure AA success.