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As an aside to the original question posed by the colonel , but back on the wagon regarding 'Marks' , and purely for discussion .
Juli said "In HRC the(1) handler always uses a duck call for the test to start, at which time the judges will signal the gunners/throwers. In AKC and NAHRA it varies. Handler may be asked to use a duck call, otherwise,(2) as with FT, a signal to the judges with a wave of a hand, and then the judges signal the guns to throw. "
(1) In real life ,I have never had a duck quack next to the dog unless it was in the farmyard , just wondering if this is possibly just a 'wake up call' for the dog or the gunners in the hide ? or merely superfluous. Would it not be more beneficial for the Throwers to quack before they Threw the bird ?
(2) I suppose ones interpretation of testing 'Marking ability of the dog ' and complying with the rules of 'all being fair' for all dogs having the exact same scenario.
In real life , I would expect the dog to be scanning the area in front of where we are sighted for 'any movement' in the sky or ground at any height or any background , following a shot from either the handler or 'other shooter' .
.....
:)
Anyways, our side of the pond in working tests is very similar in basic construction to AKC , but never did understand why a stinky dead duck that doesn't move is actually required . We do have the odd 'Cold game tests', but they are usually just to confirm fur and feather in the gob tenderly to hand.
Horses for courses , but I'm just sitting in a chair thinking ......? What's marking' anyway , according to the dog .
 

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A British style send out on a mark, and that's you catching the early bus home is how it looks to me. I recall your thread asking about it a while ago; drunkenpoacher and Paul both thought it would be allowable in US competitions, albeit pretty useless. Presumably they were referring to blinds.
If this is what you mean by "British style send out", there is no AKC rule against it on blinds or marks in hunt tests or field trials.
Dog Plant Dog breed Carnivore Tree

I don't know that much about UKC rules other than some make no sense to me so I would not be surprise if this broke one or more of them.
Be aware that if you send like this at a field trial the ensuing laughter from onlookers may distract the dog.

I and most handlers I know do not point to marks or blinds at all. Before sending the dog I make sure he is lined up from tail to snout straight toward the mark or blind. Putting a hand down over the dogs head tells him he is lined up and focused correctly.
 

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That's it, DP. I maintain we could ship a contingent of our carrier flight deck guys over to Blighty and with their semaphoring expertise, they would be dominating British field trials PDQ. Of course, in marrying them to the moment of opportunity, they might have to take Lean Mac offspring across the pond to project the true takeoff (and landing) speed of 'Merican retrievers that match up with strutting heir semaphore stuff!

Joint White Font Line Pattern


JMarti, thanks for those HT videos, nicely done and reminds me of what fun NAHRA can be - especially (Polmaise, take note) with a Boykin. Last NAHRA Senior Test I ran, a 25-pound Boykin jumped out of a boat for a water triple in 23 degree weather, ran a water blind in same weather against a buffeting crosswind, and got all this fun started by smacking a land triple and one-whistling the land blind after the test dog, an NRC finalist, had shown how to do it with a little less success.

MG
 

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Robert - in answer to your question regarding the use of duck calls

I believe the intent of the duck call by the handler is to try to replicate a duck hunt in which the hunter is calling birds to bring them into the dekes. The call also has a way of making the dog a little anxious 🤣 and this tests the dog's ability to sit when presented with (what the dog believes) is an exciting situation.

The fact that there are no calls from the field (for hrc tests) is to simulate the more silent flight of ducks as they approach said hunter and his decoys. (Although I know this is not entirely factual as ducks do make noise when they fly, as do geese LOL). No noise in the field gives the dog a little more challenge in locating where the bird is coming from - sometimes as much as 180 degree turn - and the dog benefits greatly from learning how to 'swing with the gun'.

In the AKC hunt test there will be both call and shot from the gun stations/gunners that throw said bird except during the walkup, which is intended to simulate jump shooting/upland hunting.
 

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Last NAHRA Senior Test I ran, a 25-pound Boykin jumped out of a boat for a water triple in 23 degree weather, ran a water blind in same weather against a buffeting crosswind, and got all this fun started by smacking a land triple and one-whistling the land blind after the test dog, an NRC finalist, had shown how to do it with a little less success.

MG
Only a matter of time before the Boykins dominate the field trial world.

(Although I know this is not entirely factual as ducks do make noise when they fly, as do geese LOL)
Also when hunting the ducks are FLYING, the dogs can see them, are looking for them and the good dogs often see them first.
 

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Here is a good video of an HRC seasoned level test. This is the middle of the 3 levels of tests in HRC.

"Nala" ran in a derby I judged this fall. She was the most entertaining dog there. Jumped as high and far as she could on every water entry, even went out of the way a little on the return to hit some extra water, very fun to watch. Placed 3rd I think.
 

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Only a matter of time before the Boykins dominate the field trial world.
Gotta get eligible for 'em (FTs) first, DP - but yeah, I would've been tickled to take a crack at Qs with that little brown dog.

Also you "credited" me with a quote that belongs to Tobias:
(Although I know this is not entirely factual as ducks do make noise when they fly, as do geese LOL)
to which you responded:
Also when hunting the ducks are FLYING, the dogs can see them, are looking for them and the good dogs often see them first.
In actual fact, my reply would be, even the bad dogs could see them first (ducks and especially geese) if they (ducks, geese) were "flying" through the water to be seen in order to see/watch a certain dog in the first place -

Water Cloud Sky Bird Dog


MG
 

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In actual fact, my reply would be, even the bad dogs could see them first (ducks and especially geese) if they (ducks, geese) were "flying" through the water to be seen in order to see/watch a certain dog in the first place -
I was quoting Tobias, No idea why it appears to be you.
Ducks and geese flying through water? I have no idea, would you mind translating?
 
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Gotta get eligible for 'em (FTs) first, DP - but yeah, I would've been tickled to take a crack at Qs with that little brown dog.

Also you "credited" me with a quote that belongs to Tobias:


to which you responded:


In actual fact, my reply would be, even the bad dogs could see them first (ducks and especially geese) if they (ducks, geese) were "flying" through the water to be seen in order to see/watch a certain dog in the first place -

View attachment 87970

MG
GREAT pic of a little RED dog working their magic on a raft of geese!
 

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"Nala" ran in a derby I judged this fall. She was the most entertaining dog there. Jumped as high and far as she could on every water entry, even went out of the way a little on the return to hit some extra water, very fun to watch. Placed 3rd I think.
I believe she is a Mully puppy (?). I saw her at a hunt test when she was a puppy.

The video series from The Retriever Nation is quite informative for me and I thank them for posting them. And the Clean Run Films are also very, very good. Very nice for people to post videos like these to help others learn.
 
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