[john fallon]

I see the words "local Judges" bantered about in a manner which makes the term to be tantamount to "Poor Judges".

To my way of thinking, a long trip to an event—either by air or otherwise—does nothing for ones ability to judge.

Keeping it real regards,

john

 

[Lady Duck Hunter]

Thank you, John, I agree.

 

[Jerry]

Not "poor Judges", just get tired of seeing them all the time in local area.

Jerry

 

[Ted Shih]

It is rare that a club flies someone out to judge who is not an eight point judge. There are several reasons that clubs fly their eight point judges out to judge their trials. Some of those reasons are centered around the “foreign” judges.

1. “Foreign” judges are new to the area, new to the contestants, and may set up different tests than the “local” folk are accustomed to seeing.
2. “Foreign” judges are less likely to have personal affiliations - or animosities - with competing pros and amateurs in the area.
3. “Foreign” judges may be less likely to have preconceived notions about a particular dog.

Some of those reasons are centered around "local" judges.

1. People who give their time to work are often the same people who give their help to put on trials. If you take a person out of the help mix to judge, you may place a real burden on the club.
2. Local judges may prefer to judge in areas where they will see different dogs, handlers, and terrain.
3. Local judges may prefer to avoid issues of personal affiliations - or animosities - when they judge their pros, training parties, friends, or enemies.

 

[Angie B]

It is rare that a club flies someone out to judge who is not an eight point judge. There are several reasons that clubs fly their eight point judges out to judge their trials. Some of those reasons are centered around the “foreign” judges.

1. “Foreign” judges are new to the area, new to the contestants, and may set up different tests than the “local” folk are accustomed to seeing.
2. “Foreign” judges are less likely to have personal affiliations - or animosities - with competing pros and amateurs in the area.
3. “Foreign” judges may be less likely to have preconceived notions about a particular dog.

Some of those reasons are centered around "local" judges.

1. People who give their time to work are often the same people who give their help to put on trials. If you take a person out of the help mix to judge, you may place a real burden on the club.
2. Local judges may prefer to judge in areas where they will see different dogs, handlers, and terrain.
3. Local judges may prefer to avoid issues of personal affiliations - or animosities - when they judge their pros, training parties, friends, or enemies.

There ya go! Beautiful! Well said Ted..... :wink:

Angie

 

[badbullgator]

I see the words "local Judges" bantered about in a manner which makes the term to be tantamount to "Poor Judges".

To my way of thinking, a long trip to an event—either by air or otherwise—does nothing for ones ability to judge.

Keeping it real regards,

john

John
I used that term in another post, but not as a derogatory term or with the intention on saying they were not good judges. My point in saying local judges was kind of what Jerry is getting at. Down here in the bottom half of Florida we have 4 AKC test and 3 HRC each year. Due to our “local” pool depth being rather shallow in number you will see the same judges, in different capacities, at probably 4-5 of the seven tests and some will be at all. Now while they are, for the most part, good and even great judges, you kind of get tired of seeing the same judges. From their point of view I would bet it gets tiring setting up and running on the same test grounds over and over again and I am sure there are dogs and handlers they would rather not judge over and over again.
Love most of our local judge’s regards

 

[john fallon]

Since the term Eight Point Judge has been brought into the mix, along with the fact that one tires of seeing the same ol' faces judging, let me pose this.

If you judge often enough—simply because you will— that people are tired of seeing you you are probably an 8 point judge.

You are asked to judge locally because you will, then you are asked to judge out of your area because you have said yes enough times that you are an Eight Point Judge :roll: and/or have become indebted to the person asking. . . and are judging on a quid pro quo agreement for them having judged for you and your club in the past.

Coupled with the fact that there is no repository for information about your performance during these 8 or more assignments, the intrinsic value of the term Eight Point Judge as a stand alone indicator of worth, is called into question.

The people in the examples above may be the best judges to have ever come down the pike, then again they may not.

My point is that, by and large, when the terms are used to compare two judges, the inference is that the Foreign Eight Point Judge is a better Judge, when, as in the examples above, there is absolutely no basis for this conclusion in fact

Then there is the person that is asked to judge because of their celebrity, and have become eight point judges almost overnight.
Don't even get me started on that :twisted:


john

 

[Miriam Wade]

OMG!! I understand (perfectly) everything John just said & I (gulp) agree. :shock: However, as has been pointed out on other threads-since I don't judge-my opinion doesn't count (or I'd go on...).

Just think John, if we'd been married & had children-they would have been very bright, but nobody would understand what the he!! they were talking about! :wink:
M

 

[MF]

Let's see.

1. Local judges donate their time to judge your dogs.

2. Local judges have much less expenses and help keep your entry fees to a minimum.

3. You claim you are tired of seeing them. I am sure they as volunteers feel the same way about your dog that cant mark, won't get in the water or can be eliminated from most weekend field trials for the same faults.

4. They are usually paired up with a judge that flies or travels to judge the trial and are deemed to be 2nd in charge.

5. If you dont wish to run under your "local judge", drive 1000 miles per weekend to new grounds where you will be running under someone elses "local judge".

Just my thoughts.

 

[badbullgator]

It is rare that a club flies someone out to judge who is not an eight point judge. There are several reasons that clubs fly their eight point judges out to judge their trials. Some of those reasons are centered around the “foreign” judges.

1. “Foreign” judges are new to the area, new to the contestants, and may set up different tests than the “local” folk are accustomed to seeing.
2. “Foreign” judges are less likely to have personal affiliations - or animosities - with competing pros and amateurs in the area.
3. “Foreign” judges may be less likely to have preconceived notions about a particular dog.

Some of those reasons are centered around "local" judges.

1. People who give their time to work are often the same people who give their help to put on trials. If you take a person out of the help mix to judge, you may place a real burden on the club.
2. Local judges may prefer to judge in areas where they will see different dogs, handlers, and terrain.
3. Local judges may prefer to avoid issues of personal affiliations - or animosities - when they judge their pros, training parties, friends, or enemies.

Well said Ted and one thing left out is that sometimes the "local" judges may simply enjoy not being asked to judge the same "local" test every year so they can actually run Their dogs in a local test and sit back and enjoy instead of sitting on the stool in the sun.

 

[Bob Agnor]

I think Miriam just proposed to John :shock:

Can we bring dogs to the wedding?

 

[Gun_Dog2002]

OMG!! I understand (perfectly) everything John just said & I (gulp) agree. :shock: However, as has been pointed out on other threads-since I don't judge-my opinion doesn't count (or I'd go on...).

Just think John, if we'd been married & had children-they would have been very bright, but nobody would understand what the he!! they were talking about! :wink:
M

Ok, can't wrap my mind around this one....

/paul

 

[Miriam Wade]

Let's see.

1. Local judges donate their time to judge your dogs.

I don't think anyone is arguing that point and asppreciates the effort. I've also judged a few times myself, but only at the started level

2. Local judges have much less expenses and help keep your entry fees to a minimum.

Often times "local" just means region & often these judges are given the same accomodations as out of the region judges-whether that's a motel or staying in a club member's home.

3. You claim you are tired of seeing them. I am sure they as volunteers feel the same way about your dog that cant mark, won't get in the water or can be eliminated from most weekend field trials for the same faults.

I'm absolutely not saying that I'm tired of seeing them. (ok-there are one or two! :wink: ) That's not my point at all. There are a LOT of local judges I truly look forward to seeing & I don't equate who is judging with my dog's performance-good or bad. I do however, enjoy seeing a fresh face and gain a new perspective of the grounds that I've been on running on for years.

4. They are usually paired up with a judge that flies or travels to judge the trial and are deemed to be 2nd in charge.

I have only run HTs (& 1 Derby) & flying in judges has not been the norm (I said the norm-someone will surely say that it has been done) in the AKC tests I've run.

5. If you dont wish to run under your "local judge", drive 1000 miles per weekend to new grounds where you will be running under someone elses "local judge".

I've done that too-although for the fun of it-not to avoid anyone locally.

Just my thoughts.

 

[Miriam Wade]

I think Miriam just proposed to John :shock:

Can we bring dogs to the wedding?

I'm getting married?!? Wait! I hear the faint sound of John frantically looking for the tallest bridge he can find.

Don't Jump John Regards-

M

 

[Shayne Mehringer]

Ted nailed it. Very well said.

SM

 

[Gerard Rozas]

Opinions from a judge that normally flies in - FWIW

I LOVE a local judge that has competed at the level of stake we are judging at.

I LOVE a local judge that knows the grounds well.

I LOVE a local judge that knows where FT stakes have run in the past and what they have done - esp when it comes to water blinds.

I LOVE a local judge that knows the local plants, animals, ditches, generally dangerous things to avoid for dogs or humans.

I LOVE a local judge who is familar with wind directions, sun directions, weather patterns for the area.

I LOVE a local judge that knows what fields trail, what water is running water, what water is swimming water.

I LOVE a local judge that knows what resteraunts to avoid - and where the best steak is found.

A good local judge is your buddy, your resource, your partner for the weekend. He informs you of political traps, camp/personnel conflicts and keeps you on the up and up.

 

[Gun_Dog2002]

I would actually contend that the problem isn't just using local judges. Its using the same local judges over and over again. Some clubs insist on using the same judges, on the same grounds resulting in the same bloody tests and setups again and again. Here in the NW we have a ton of good solid judges, yet over and over again you'll walk to the line and see the same "I haven't trained a dog to this level in 20 years" judge sitting there getting ready to start drawing stick pictures. I then get to see the same wide open triple. Heck I had one dog that literally got 2 Senior passes running the same exact tests1 month apart. I kid you not the birds landed on the exact same blade of grass thrown from the same brown spot on earth. Course the clubs have the same board members, picking their "friends" or negotiating judging assisments with other clubs all the time. Good ole boys networking at its finest.

/Paul

 

[Patrick Johndrow]

It is rare that a club flies someone out to judge who is not an eight point judge. There are several reasons that clubs fly their eight point judges out to judge their trials. Some of those reasons are centered around the “foreign” judges.

1. “Foreign” judges are new to the area, new to the contestants, and may set up different tests than the “local” folk are accustomed to seeing.
2. “Foreign” judges are less likely to have personal affiliations - or animosities - with competing pros and amateurs in the area.
3. “Foreign” judges may be less likely to have preconceived notions about a particular dog.

Some of those reasons are centered around "local" judges.

1. People who give their time to work are often the same people who give their help to put on trials. If you take a person out of the help mix to judge, you may place a real burden on the club.
2. Local judges may prefer to judge in areas where they will see different dogs, handlers, and terrain.
3. Local judges may prefer to avoid issues of personal affiliations - or animosities - when they judge their pros, training parties, friends, or enemies.

"Familiarity breed contempt and children" Mark Twain

 

[TxFig]

I see the words "local Judges" bantered about in a manner which makes the term to be tantamount to "Poor Judges".

To my way of thinking, a long trip to an event—either by air or otherwise—does nothing for ones ability to judge.

I don't know about that - I have been invited to a "long trip" exactly once. Went to Alb, NM. Judged both days. Had an absolute blast.

 

[EdA]

resteraunts .

but mostly HE LOVES a local judge who knows how to SPELL "restaurant" :wink: