RetrieverTraining.Net - the RTF banner

1 - 10 of 10 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
59 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a question about pattern blinds. I have a 4 yo male that is through transition and running pretty good cold blinds but sometimes has a little trouble holding his line when going into cover at an angle or if we are tying to cut a corner of water say 150 yds out. My question first is do any of you go back and run pattern blinds after the dog is running cold blinds. And the second question is do yal put more factors in the pattern blind such as cutting short corners on water or multiple entrys. Thanks in advance
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
779 Posts
There are different schools of thought on this issue. Some like to re-visit patterns, but I think most, once graduating to cold binds, do not advocate going back to the pattern field. Patterns are intended to teach momentum, holding a straight line on the initial send and use repetition to ingrain the sequence of cues for a blind. They are less about teaching factors and casting.j

In order to work on concepts, like cutting corners of water or cover, or multiple re-entries, I prefer to teach using Pop-up blinds or permanent taught (school) blinds. First I move up to place the factor or re-entry in the first third of the blind, rather than the middle or end. I teach it up close (since distance erodes control) then gradually back up once my dog is 85% or more successful at each stage. I try to find 3 to 5 school blinds in different locations that include the same concept. Once taught, I come back and run these same blinds cold once a week or so until the dog is lining each one. Then I start incorporating the concept into cold blinds keeping the factor in the 1st third of the blind and eventually moving it to the middle and end as my dog shows an understanding of the concept and has success.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,252 Posts
Agree with Dan's post, I don't go back to pattern blinds. Once I start running cold blinds, I don't run the dogs multiple times to the same location in one training session. I will re-run a blind I have previously run (memory blind) a couple weeks later. And I do land tune up drills where I will repeat a series of land blinds more often. This could be referred to as pattern blinds because we run them so often, but I don't repeat them in one session like you do when running PBs in transition. I'd ask the OP...
What do you do when your dog has this trouble (how do you handle)?
Do you typically just run a single blind with this factor or do you run 3-5 blinds repeating the same concept?

I prefer to teach a dog to deal with factors by running multiple blinds that repeat a concept rather than repeat the same blind. Your handling of the dog as soon as you read he has given in to the factor is what teaches them to run straight (over time).

Mike Lardy said at a workshop that I attended that dogs cheat water, but they negotiate cover. What appears to be a very clean picture to you from 150 yards away, may look very different up close and at dog's eye level. Dogs will tend to pick there way through cover so it's not as clean and clear a picture as a water cheat.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,270 Posts
Dan, I understand what you said. My question. How much land do you have access to? After running one nearly seven yo dog I have a hard time finding places that we haven't been and worked, especially water since it is more limited.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
59 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I have the same issue as Wayne with the water I only have about 2 maybe three places that I can teach a same concept in a different blind like cuting a corner and some of the other things. And most of the water I have acsess to is private but fairly big like 5-7 acres ponds. So he gets alot of open water swims on any long blind. And actually only have one place to teach a mutiple entry because I am very limited to water with this kind of opportunity. So if I run more than to blinds with multiple entries my blinds would be very close together. Thanks for all the help though.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,095 Posts
I have a question about pattern blinds. I have a 4 yo male that is through transition and running pretty good cold blinds but sometimes has a little trouble holding his line when going into cover at an angle or if we are tying to cut a corner of water say 150 yds out. My question first is do any of you go back and run pattern blinds after the dog is running cold blinds. And the second question is do yal put more factors in the pattern blind such as cutting short corners on water or multiple entrys. Thanks in advance
Tune-up drills. If possible, find a place where you can run multiple blinds that, in some way, incorporate the concept that you are looking to address. Try for a minimum of three such blinds but you can go to a much higher number so long as the length is such that you don't over-tax the dog. Also, you don't need the same starting point for each blind. Find starting points that will give you the desired concept. Start your tune-up drill by running each of the blinds cold. As best you can, you want to maintain a good attitude and a high standard. Literal casts and attrition (truly understanding attrition is important) to get what you need. Accept that the work may be a little sloppy at first and, hopefully, will improve over the course of the drill both each day and over the time-frame you run the tune-up drill. I endeavor, and hope, to use few collar corrections. Run the blinds for several days in a row until you have generally strong performance over all of the blinds. This drill works wonders and can be used many times, in many different places, over the competitive life of the dog.

I have gone back to pattern blinds to work on a dog who was too confident/headstrong and who would sometimes auto-cast. It was a five blind pattern and I would send for one blind and then stop and send him all over the field to any of the others. Got this from Glenda Brown through Jack Vollstedt and it worked great.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,252 Posts
... So if I run more than to blinds with multiple entries my blinds would be very close together. Thanks for all the help though.
A typical 3 peat blind could have three blinds that cross a single point. Have three lines and 3 blinds all intersecting at that single point. Can do the same with a 3 peat blind tight to a gun. These blinds are fairly close together. I don't like open water blinds as there is no reason for the dog to be any particular place. I mean what difference would it make if the dog was 5 yards left or right of the true line? I'd try to do more down the shore stuff.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
59 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Thanks for all the help. I have a question about the tune-up drill golden boy is referring to. Are u running these same blinds several days in a row? If so would the not be a pattern blind and be more of a taught blind I am guessing. And captainjack i understand what you mean about the open water swims and really he does not seem to much to care for a 150-200 yard big water swim. He really begans just looking for something rather than keeping his momentum driving back when faced with a really big swim like that. And as u say there is not truely a whole lot to be gained from that. And thanks again for all the help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,095 Posts
For tune-up drills.

Run the blinds for several days in a row until you have generally strong performance over all of the blinds.
As other people have mentioned, try to run multiple blinds whenever you train. Even better if each of them incorporates the same concept in some manner. Even better, try to lay out your week to involve a single concept that runs throughout both your marks and blinds. Like hitting pieces of water, or cross wind, or angling hills, and on and on...

After a while, and only from time to time, you can combine factors and concepts and really blow their minds. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
59 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I do always try to run multiple blinds and marks each time and sometimes run them together and sometimes seperate the two and run a set of blinds then let him rest while I set up some marks. It's just difficult sometimes to be able to run several setups and focus on one thing such as hitting pieces of water without running something again due to not having enough places with water to run. But I do have lots of land to run on and we do take days now and then and work on angling hills and crosswinds a that type stuff. I have a 333 acres of farm land and pasture to train in but only 3 different pieces of water to use as of now. And with it getting so hot here in ga it's hard to run several setups of each. I am going to talk to some of the people close by with cattle farm who have ponds and try to get some more pieces of water to use. Thanks again for all the help.
 
1 - 10 of 10 Posts
Top