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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Here is my situation. My dog has done pile work just fine at 115 yards +. She will go and go to it. I am working her on T work now and she still does pretty good, but I would like some tips on what you would do in the situation. I started working her with pile 2 on the left side. I send her to pile 1 twice. then the third time i stop her mid ways, and send her to the left. She goes with no problem. The next time i sent her towards pile 1, and she was lined up exactly towards pile 1, and when i sent her, she went straight at pile 2 (as shown as "Y" on the drawing. I stopped her, brought her back to the line, then sent her to pile 1 with no problem. I then sent her to 1 a couple of times, then stopped her half way to 1 and sent her to 2. again with no problem. the very next time i sent her to 1, she started towards one, then curved towards 2 (which was the last pile she visited.) I stopped her at point "X" on the drawing, then sent her to pile 1 and she went directly towards 1. My question is this, when she heads in the wrong direction, should i stop her and send her from where she is or should i bring her back to line and try and get her going straight? and i am not using e collar. she handles very good once i correct her, but i want to get her following the correct line from the beginning.
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Is there a reason for not using an e-collar? If your not going to then attrition is your friend. Always stop her and make her return to you and resend. your going to need alot of repatition to the back pile. I like to say 10 back and 1 over when begining. Your goal here is to get the dog to line where your sending her first then teach the overs, both of them. I don't know how your going to get a correction otherwise. The only correction you have now is a stern no-here resend. Others who train without an e-collar should have a better idea I would think.
 

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Stop her and cast her to pile one when she does this. It is a handling drill.

They all do this at some point in the T and TT.

Are you not using a collar at all, or just not yet for this particular issue?

Marcy
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
It might be good to to give info on the dog. She is almost 7 years old, and I trained her myself from a pup and she was top notch. She has been a great meat dog for me, but the last year we moved and did not have good training grounds near by, plus my job made it to where i did not have time to hunt or even do any training with her. so she pretty much had a year off. but i am back in it now and able to give her the work and attention she needs. so on one hand we are refreshing/relearning some things. I do not use an e collar one, because i do not have one, and two because I trained her as good as I did without one and really cant afford one right now.
 

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As soon as you see she has taken the wrong line give her a "no here" and resend. You may have to shorten up a bit until she gets the idea. And yes, leave the collar in the truck, at this point you are trying to teach. not give corrections. Don't forget to pour on the praise when she does it right!
 

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As soon as you see she has taken the wrong line give her a "no here" and resend. You may have to shorten up a bit until she gets the idea. And yes, leave the collar in the truck, at this point you are trying to teach. not give corrections. Don't forget to pour on the praise when she does it right!
I agree with this.
 

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I don't use an ecollar for T and TT.
I also train on a slope.
When my dogs do what your dog does, I whistle stop them and give them a cast to the pile they were supposed to go to. When they do make this mistake, after the "correction" (the stop and handle)they don't do it again.
It appears to be a confusion - all they need is for it to be cleared up.
 

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When through all of the yard work and running cold blinds, I will recall for a cop out on the initial line. Such as the dog looking at pile 1 and then going directly toward pile 2 when sent. If dog starts toward pile 1 and then curves toward pile 2, I stop and handle. In thinking about where you are in training, I wouldn't do too much if any recalling with a young dog as this kills momentum in many dogs. I don't recall until I have introduced wagon wheel lining or the no-no drill (jumping log enroute to pile). The no-no conditions the dog to being recalled. When I do the no-no drill it isn't "NO, HERE!", but rather "no, here", lets try this again.

I always have the ecollar on my dogs in every training session. I may not turn it on or use it, but it is always on the dog.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
i appreciate all the feedback. I just took her out for an afternoon session, and she did better. I had a T set up with the back pile at 100 yards and two side piles about 25 yards off the main line. i had 5 dummies in back pile and 2 on each side. i sent her to back pile 3 times in a row with no hitches. sent her back and stopped her mid way and sent her right. still no prob. next i sent to back pile and she went straight back, but at the exact spot that i sent her right in the previous run, she turned right and went to that pile. i stopped her, and cast her to the back pile and she went with no trouble. next i sent her back and then cast to left pile with no trouble. overall, she did really good. there were a couple of times that she veered off towards the wrong pile, but whistle and cast got her in correct direction.

after the first T, i put all 5 dummies in the back pile and only 1 on each side. i sent her back more and she got to making a straight line to it without getting sidetracked by the side piles.

thanks for the help!
 

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As a general rule, you can call back if they take a wrong direction when you send or immediately thereafter. If they veer off once on their way, handle. The softer dogs handle more, the hard headed sob's can take more callbacks.

This is mostly a rule of thumb and not cast in stone.
 

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i sent her to back pile 3 times in a row with no hitches. sent her back and stopped her mid way and sent her right. still no prob. next i sent to back pile and she went straight back, but at the exact spot that i sent her right in the previous run, she turned right and went to that pile. i stopped her, and cast her to the back pile and she went with no trouble. next i sent her back and then cast to left pile with no trouble.

thanks for the help!
1-back
2-back
3-back
4-cast right
5-back-breaks right-cast back
6-cast left

If I read it right this was your progression. I would send the dog back at least one more time in between casting, especially since she didn't run a good line to the back pile.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
1-back
2-back
3-back
4-cast right
5-back-breaks right-cast back
6-cast left

If I read it right this was your progression. I would send the dog back at least one more time in between casting, especially since she didn't run a good line to the back pile.
ya, i felt like i needed more back work, and should have done more back sends between the casts. that is one reason that i re-set it up and did a lot more backs. i for sure agree with you, more backs in between the casts is needed
 

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ya, i felt like i needed more back work, and should have done more back sends between the casts. that is one reason that i re-set it up and did a lot more backs. i for sure agree with you, more backs in between the casts is needed
I was thinking that you need to buy a few more bumpers to get through the TT, I like 2 at each of the 4 side piles and at least 2 sends to the back pile for each time you stop (just as in recalling this is not set in stone some dogs need more freebies, some can be stoppped more). Rounding it out to 24 bumpers without doing the math.

Also it appears that the distance of your back pile went from 115yds in your previous session to 100 yds today. You should use the same spot and same distance for your T work from day 1 til you finish. 100 yards is enough, I don't think you need the extra 15 yards.
 
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