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Then what is your argument? You stated that some want this trial so they have no one to run against so that their dogs can become titled then breed like rabbits. Sounds like a competition argument to me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #62 ·
Then what is your argument? You stated that some want this trial so they have no one to run against so that their dogs can become titled then breed like rabbits. Sounds like a competition argument to me.
That is only part of it, and you know it.
A group of people want to have an Open when nobody will come so their carefully chosen judges will set up the tests they have been practicing for weeks or months and award placements to their dogs giving them titles they could not otherwise achieve.
Then they brag about their great dogs and hope to profit off "FC/AFC x FC/AFC" litters.
 
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Ed, some here ask why, some here ask why not. In your opinion what are the obvious reasons?
Less competition, on my circuit much less competition, reference my previous post. And if your intent was to quote from a Robert F. Kennedy speech at least give the author credit😉
 

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That is only part of it, and you know it.
A group of people want to have an Open when nobody will come so their carefully chosen judges will set up the tests they have been practicing for weeks or months and award placements to their dogs giving them titles they could not otherwise achieve.
Then they brag about their great dogs and hope to profit off "FC/AFC x FC/AFC" litters.
EXACTLY, a competition argument. Plain and simple.
 

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Less competition, on my circuit much less competition, reference my previous post
Ok I understand that. With that being said then, if we are talking solely about a competition argument, then with all due respect to these clubs, don't we have to bring up the FT's in Alaska?

I would also add with regards to those owners & dogs you mentioned, they would not be running the trial in question nor would you most likely.
 

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why don't Alaska clubs have trials during the nationals?
Because their weekends have been what they have been for sometime.

Why don't you & your club give up your weekends and let this other club have them. Then you guys could move to alternative weekends that work for you. Seems like a simple solution.
 

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And if your intent was to quote from a Robert F. Kennedy speech at least give the author credit😉
I had no idea I was quoting RFK. I was just writing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #70 ·
Because their weekends have been what they have been for sometime.

Why don't you & your club give up your weekends and let this other club have them. Then you guys could move to alternative weekends that work for you. Seems like a simple solution.
I'll give you the answer. Alaska clubs hold trials in Alaska because they are in Alaska. Alaska clubs don't hold trials during the nationals because members hope to go to the nationals, they respect the sport and they want anyone and everyone to be able to enter their events. The last thing they want is to reduce the entry numbers.

No club will or should give up their weekend to the club in question.
What is your connection to them? Are you entering the trial?
 
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Discussion Starter · #71 · (Edited)
"I did enter the Special Olympics. I can call it that, you cannot."

Can you not see that this is in extremely poor taste? By reiterating it you are offering a window into your true character, which is, sadly, lacking.

And no, I don't believe your reason for entering the event, nor do I believe you would not have used points you might have earned.
Lighten up Paul. Nobody’s offended including you.
I support your right to believe whatever you want.

Just curious, how do you think specialty points should be counted?
 

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Lighten up Paul. Nobody’s offendedincluding you.
I support your right to believe whatever you want.

Just curious, how do you think specialty points should be counted?
I would not have made that post if I didn't feel it was offensive and in poor taste.
Just the way they are now. There's no need to re-invent the wheel. - Paul
 

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Discussion Starter · #73 ·
I would not have made that post if I didn't feel it was offensive and in poor taste.
Just the way they are now. There's no need to re-invent the wheel. - Paul
Alright then, I offer my sincerest apology, I was thoughtless, cruel and failed to consider that my comments might trigger you and possibly others, but probably just you.

So you believe specialty points are of lesser value than points from all breed trials? That's offensive.
 

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I had no idea I was quoting RFK. I was just writing.
Robert F.Kennedy paraphrasing the playwright George Bernard Shaw. “There are those who look at things the way they are, and ask why ... I dream of things that never were, and ask why not?”
 

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Discussion Starter · #75 ·
By entering a one of the club trials in question, does anyone think it reflects badly the handlers and any points or titles given to a dog?
 

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IMO much to do about nothing it is one weekend a year, say the national is on the west coast and the club wanting to run the trial is on the east. Not every dog qualified for the national goes to it. Perhaps the club has other items, they have limited window for access to grounds, or weather or something. Still you are talking one weekend a year, for one dog to perhaps get a win? This is going to cause a whole problem with breeding stock? 1-4 dogs might get 1st-4th ribbons one weekend a year? Heck knowing FT people even if it was in the same area, many of the competitors would most likely run the national, then drive to the other trial inbtw national series (which are very long days without running), just to get practice for the next series of the national. They are all out training on other properties inbtw series as it is. People have done it to get derby points; gone back and forth. If it's a tradition thing, welp that's tradition. But the idea that it will allow perhaps lacking dogs to title is ludicrous; they'd have to win multiple years at a single trial; where competition is somehow less, and this will give them an inferior FC-AFC title?. If we are concerned about such things we should be equally consern with AA trials that have 30 dogs vs. those that have 120 entries. I'm sure that trial with 30 is definitely allowing mediocre dogs to title over the "better" dog that wins out of 120 entries. (this statement is j/k).
 
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Discussion Starter · #78 ·
Now that the entries for the trial in question have closed, it appears to me that the competition in the Open will not be as lackluster as you predicted. -Paul
You should have entered Paul, next year you will have to qualify for the NARC to run all age that weekend.
 

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"Since when did the RAC concern itself with equality in entry size or level of competition in awarding points?"
A long time ago? Maybe Dr Ed or Marvin know the answer.
When I got into the sport a dog that was QAA was a very valuable insurance policy for the 12 QAA dog requirement.
The 1967 & 1973 NFC's originated there along with the 1968 NAFC. The hot stud in the country was a dog from
Rapid City, SD along with being a fairly sturdy competitor. A 20 dog Open was won by a dog that was a ND HI Point
2 years previous, 2nd to a very good local dog, also a Derby lister, 3rd escapes me, & 4th to Dagne, the 1964 NFC.
So even with 20 dogs there was a quality field.

The idea that Alaska is a wasteland is not true, they go through periods of low turnout, but the idea of facing McFall,
Ferrucci, Niemi & there was 1 other at the time was not for someone willing to spend a lot to get 4th place. The loss
of someone highly talented at a young age hurts those places harder than some place with a wealth of competitors.
These competitors also ran the West Coast circuit in the spring with great success. Anyone who says otherwise is not
up to date on FT history.

I can remember the year Gonia went to TX to run Spring Trials at the request of a client. The people running the Open
there probably remember that well as he cleaned up. He also spent some time hunting quail & expressed his admiration
for the pointers that worked for them. His comment for TX "everything either stings, bites, grabs you or punches a hole
in you as you walk through the fields.

As for the OP - the premier event of any sport normally have that week to themselves.
 
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As for the OP - the premier event of any sport normally have that week to themselves.
Can you give us a few examples of sports where there are not other competitive leagues and such?

The NFL, NHL, NBA and MLB are out.
 
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