[Jeff Huntington]

Hypothetical thought....

Two breedings identical except the dam on litter #1 is a MH/HRCH and the dam for litter #2 is a JH/SHR. Sire is FC/AFC

How much more is the MH dam litter worth?

Is there enough of a difference?

 

[Dan Storts]

Genetically speaking even if the dams are littermates they will bring a different percentage of the sire and dam genetics to the table. However, training could be a factor and the JH could actually be the better dog. You know may or may not know if the JH had the opportunity to be exposed to good training. The title will increase the value some and if she was a FC/AFC it would be even higher.

 

[metalone67]

Genetically speaking even if the dams are littermates they will bring a different percentage of the sire and dam genetics to the table. However, training could be a factor and the JH could actually be the better dog. You know may or may not know if the JH had the opportunity to be exposed to good training. The title will increase the value some and if she was a FC/AFC it would be even higher.

If the JH was never tested by the owners any further due to funds or time, I would look at her pedigree. I've seen pedigrees where mom didn't have a title but yet produced some FC offspring.

 

[Rob Paye]

There is ALOT more to it than the bitch of the litter.

 

[codyspringer]

I'd say the MH/HRCH litter tends to bring $5-700 more a pup.

 

[Trevor Toberny]

I don't think a mH bitch will bring that much more. I would say $200 more. There is so much more that goes into it. My female is only a JH but should have gone alot further but other factors got in way before I had her.

 

[Trevor Toberny]

What I should have said is MH bitch won't bring that much more than a JH in this soft market

 

[codyspringer]

I see a lot of FC/AFC X JH going for $4-600, FC/AFC X MH $8-1200. So potentialy I guess u could say a $200 diff on the low end and $800 on the high end which brings you back to the more things to consider.

 

[justin300mag]

I see a lot of FC/AFC X JH going for $4-600, FC/AFC X MH $8-1200. So potentialy I guess u could say a $200 diff on the low end and $800 on the high end which brings you back to the more things to consider.

A pup out of an fc afc for $400. I have got to see that.

 

[Jeff Huntington]

There is ALOT more to it than the bitch of the litter.

I said all else equal yes I know there is a lot more to it but

 

[Trevor Toberny]

Show me a litter out of a FC AFC x JH with a strong background for 400. I saw a 500 litter out of FC candle wood man in black but the bitch side had nothing in it.

 

[Jeff Huntington]

What I should have said is MH bitch won't bring that much more than a JH in this soft market

Interesting the soft market, yet right now there seems to be so many dams that do not have advanced titles that are being bred to higher level dogs....

I guess the question is do you wait and put a MH on a dam or just elect to breed her at JH. Does the MH guarantee that the pups will be better dogs then the JH dam...no way of proving except in a buyer's beliefs.

I know some folks who will not breed until the dam gets the advanced titles while others get the entry level and start breeding.

Maybe its just a different clientelle that want the advanced dam compared to the one's who look at pedigree without too much weighting on the dam's individual accomplishments.

Guess it gets back to the market and your potential buyer. Some folks are just not going to pay for a MH dam breeding regardless of potential.

Too many questions, too little time.

PS. maybe its not the individual accomplishments that initally attract a buyer but the overall pedigree????

 

[Kenneth Niles Bora]

I thought this thread was going to be about a Stephen Stills song.
This is the song in your dogs head during a hunt test walk up;-)
click - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gp5JCrSXkJY

.

 

[Trevor Toberny]

Yes there are lower level dogs being bred to high end dogs bcause stud owners don't say no to the money typically. Can a JH bitch bred to stud A have better pups than a MH bitch bred to stud A? Yes. It's more than the bitches titles. It's whats in pedigree and studs pedigree and how they mesh. I am sitting here looking at the catalog from last weeks trial and I bet less than 1/4 of the dogs are from FC AFc bitches.

 

[Janet Kimbrough]

I thought this thread was going to be about a Stephen Stills song.
This is the song in your dogs head during a hunt test walk up;-)
click - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gp5JCrSXkJY

.

Ken,

That is GREAT. Totally off topic but made me laugh because you are probably so right!

Janet

 

[Jacob Hawkes]

Yes there are lower level dogs being bred to high end dogs bcause stud owners don't say no to the money typically. Can a JH bitch bred to stud A have better pups than a MH bitch bred to stud A? Yes. It's more than the bitches titles. It's whats in pedigree and studs pedigree and how they mesh. I am sitting here looking at the catalog from last weeks trial and I bet less than 1/4 of the dogs are from FC AFc bitches.

Yet they get the majority of the placements & titles. It's really a no brainer here. Momma matters most.

 

[WBF]

Yes, I personally think that if you want high dollar meaning $1,000-$2,000 out of an FC AFC stud. The bitch needs to either have proven to be a producer from past low end breedings meaning up to $800. Or she has AT LEAST a MH title or QAA status with a decent pedigree. Majority of the buyers out there don't want holes in the pedigrees. The market is flooded with great breedings.

 

[Jeff Huntington]

Yes there are lower level dogs being bred to high end dogs bcause stud owners don't say no to the money typically. Can a JH bitch bred to stud A have better pups than a MH bitch bred to stud A? Yes. It's more than the bitches titles. It's whats in pedigree and studs pedigree and how they mesh. I am sitting here looking at the catalog from last weeks trial and I bet less than 1/4 of the dogs are from FC AFc bitches.

Could it be that FC to a JH attracts the HT guy whereas the FC to FC attracts the FT guy. Wonder how many people have bought FC to FC with the intention of only running HT venue? Guess it still comes back to who your target market is....

FC to FC... FT or high performance dog folks/ maybe high level HT folks
FC or GRHRCH to MH or QAA.. combination FT performance and HT high performance folks
FC to JH... HT performance or other folks
MH/HRCH to equivalent or less... HT folks
nothing to nothing.... pet folks


As a breeder do you define your target market before the breeding or line up the breeding assuming the market will be there. Now if you are an established breeder, you have a distinct advantage.

 

[Vic Batton]

Yet they get the majority of the placements & titles. It's really a no brainer here. Momma matters most.

Well put Jacob

 

[Trevor Toberny]

That would be a neat study to looking into how many FC AFC over the last say 10-15 years are out of hint test bitches or field trial bitches.