What's happening at the SRS event?
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unfortunatly, that thread is calming down. I was hoping that Ken would jump in one more time and give her a stir, but I imagine he is at a trial by now.Aussie said:
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i think Ken will have a BIG fan club in hot springs.........
Ken, if you ever need a job, i think the HR office where i work could use a communicator like you! :lolaul
Ken, if you ever need a job, i think the HR office where i work could use a communicator like you! :lol
aul
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Who are you BS-ing—A land blind before the marks happens at times at large FTs—Ken Guthrie from that link said:
john
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Here we go again.
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Or on a typical day's hunt. I tried to argue that over here, but I got put in my place...K G said:
http://www.refugeforums.com/refuge/showthread.php?t=520654
My last comment generated the sound of cricketts.
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I'm not gonna say it doesn't happen, but about all I've ever seen is someone running some blinds or even just roading their dog to settle it down before running. I think the big difference is that in HT and FT the odds of seeing something really unusual or new are much smaller than that of the SRS.K G said:
This also happened at the world championship thing a few years ago btw.
IMHO, THE biggest problem with SRS is the seeding of the dogs. The "better" dogs do have the opportunities to run off and train on casting out of a boat or maybe something else thats very odd. Is it illegal? I don't think so. Should it be illegal? I don't think so because it would be almost impossible to prove/enforce.
How about this, put all the names in a bucket and draw 5 or10 at a time, let those know that they are coming up. That way everyone else has to stick around to make sure they aren't in the next few to run. :wink:
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I have seen training on the grounds one time but heard about it several times….the one time I witnessed the training it didn’t help the guy and the FT committee was notified but did nothing about it. for reasons never known to me or the person that reported the infractionK G said:
I think it is a little like cramming ten minutes before a test…how much good does it really do?
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Its been my belief for many years, that watching the test and then going to train for the test is not that successful. If the dog didn't know before getting their, he ain't gonna learn it while there.
/Paul
/Paul
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Your opinion has seldom been humble.achiro said:
I do not know if it is legal or not. I do think at the very least it is unethical.achiro said:
It should be illegal. But it wouldn't matter...either one is ethical in their approach to the sport or not.achiro said:
Thinking Out Loud Regards,
Joe S.
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I agree with the replies to my question. Do "tune ups" off the grounds happen? Sure. Do full blown training setups happen? I don't think so. I also believe that if something like the SRS boat-training scenario happened at an AKC event (FT or HT), the perpetrators would get NAILED TO THE WALL.
I think it's a shame (and a sham) that an event that enjoys the visibility that SRS does doesn't do more to ensure equitable opportunity for its participants. A running order based on a "seed?" Who/how is that "seed" determined? No rule against training on a test while the test is going on? Especially after the first dozen or so "sacrificial lambs" won't cast out of the boat (tell me THAT wasn't designed to eliminate dogs... :wink: )! Then, people justify the improvement in the work by saying the late running "better seeded" dogs are "more experienced"....gotta love it! :lol:
As someone observed on the Waterdog forum, it's "made for TV." It ain't about the dogs....it's about "The Game" and "The TV." As long as folks are good with it as it is, it will continue as it is.
Le caveat emptor regards,
kg
I think it's a shame (and a sham) that an event that enjoys the visibility that SRS does doesn't do more to ensure equitable opportunity for its participants. A running order based on a "seed?" Who/how is that "seed" determined? No rule against training on a test while the test is going on? Especially after the first dozen or so "sacrificial lambs" won't cast out of the boat (tell me THAT wasn't designed to eliminate dogs... :wink: )! Then, people justify the improvement in the work by saying the late running "better seeded" dogs are "more experienced"....gotta love it! :lol:
As someone observed on the Waterdog forum, it's "made for TV." It ain't about the dogs....it's about "The Game" and "The TV." As long as folks are good with it as it is, it will continue as it is.
Le caveat emptor regards,
kg
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Actually the one I witness was a duplication of a test that was running that the contestant had not run...collar on the dog even.K G said:
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If it's not happening on the grounds Keith, I don't think there's anything reportable. Many people go out and do something to tune up their dogs between series. Is that against the AKC rules?
How about a couple easy blinds at the motel prior to going to the grounds in the morning to run the 2nd series?
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Howard N said:
I think we are talking more about training on the FT grounds but if the Hotel is headquarter does that qualify as the FT grounds?
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I think the difference is ethics. Running a few blinds at the motel or even marks simply for the sake of tuning up the dog, as long as they are not the same or similar to what you KNOW is in the test is fine. If, on the other hand, you go and set up a blind or marks that replicate what you already know is in the test, you may not be breaking any rules, but it is unethical in my book. Of course ethics are different between individuals and others may find this far from unethical and feel they are just taking advantage of being far down in the running order. If I saw someone running the exact set-up I may or may not say anything, but I would lose any respect for s the handler who in my opinion is taking an unfair advantage (notice I do not call it cheating). It is kind of like being in school and asking someone who has a class earlier in the day what was on an exam. They may not remember the exact questions but they remember enough to say “there were several questions about…”, thus allowing you to focus on a specific topic for study. Is that cheating, maybe so maybe not, but it is an unfair advantage. I guess if someone needs to use something like this to be successful that is their problem. I want to be proud of my dog and my training and I personally would not be very proud of beating someone because I had the benefit of seeing a test and training specifically on the set-up while others did not. I would rather whip someone arse fair and square. If I lose I would hope it was because of my training failures or my dog having a bad day rather than loosing to someone who did so by unethical methods.Howard N said:
(Howard this is not implying you do this or really directed at you, just a responce to the comments)
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