if you own a FC AFC stud, what do you require?

Krissye00 · Sep 4, 2015

There are a few who require titled bitches, have never spoke to anyone who at minimum didn't at least require health testing, some have asked about pedigree.

Rainmaker · Sep 4, 2015

Justin Allen said:
No doubt about that, there are some good salesman and very uneducated buyers out there. Facebook has certainly brought it to the forefront.

Facebook has given the old newspaper type breeders and the scammers a whole new platform.

truthseeker · Sep 4, 2015

When talking about bettering the breed, this is how it usually works. You get lucky and fined a bitch that has all the tool and for some reason,( they are many) she has no titles. To proof the line you are trying to start. You want to introduce and good dog with titles, so that you can compete and have some certainty of being excepted within the community.

Keith

Rainmaker · Sep 4, 2015

Justin, clear your inbox.

Justin Allen · Sep 4, 2015

Made soon room

huntinman · Sep 4, 2015

If I ever have a stud dog that happens to be in demand, I would want to make sure the bitch had health clearances and was in fact a labrador retriever.

The free market can take care of the rest of it. The owner of the bitch is free to do what he wants with the pups once he has paid for the stud fee... I don't really care from that point on.

All the betterment of the breed and all that stuff will take care of itself. Bring your checkbook.

John Robinson · Sep 4, 2015

Trevor Toberny said:
yes im familiar with espirit out of the woods, he was also qaa and ran trials and was out of titled prents. like i said im talking about a dog that has no training, no desire to retrieve and has no titles in pedigree. im familiar with Marys breedings,again her sires are usually titled or in process and her dams have had training.
you are bringing up people who know their pedigree and bloodlines, not a random guy who bought his dog out of paper and has no retrieving desire. not sure how im arguing both sides.

I really think it's a moot point as I can't imagine mr. random guy knowing enough to seek out a titled sire with its associated high stud fee to breed his untalented bitch to, but if he did, what would it matter? As long as all the health clearances were in place, the titled stud would only help the gene pool get a little better. Better imo, than mr. random breeding his untalented bitch to an equally untalented stud.

ErinsEdge · Sep 4, 2015

Krissye00 said:
There are a few who require titled bitches, have never spoke to anyone who at minimum didn't at least require health testing, some have asked about pedigree.

Well, well, this is the person that sent me the graphic with a Silver Labrador on Kim's "supposed website" which of course she claims she didn't make up, but she did readily pass it around. Thought we wouldn't notice? Of course, she has 4 litters advertised but no accomplishments on EE as opposed to Kim who we know and love who has multiple QAA and MH's and who is known as honest and a breeder of Yellows, Chocolates, and Blacks and NOT Silvers ever.

Justin Allen · Sep 4, 2015

Hey, I'm sure a lot of thought and effort/planning went into choosing just the right studs for those 4 dogs!!

ErinsEdge said:
Well, well, this is the person that sent me the graphic with a Silver Labrador on Kim's "supposed website" which of course she claims she didn't make up, but she did readily pass it around. Thought we wouldn't notice? Of course, she has 4 litters advertised but no accomplishments on EE as opposed to Kim who we know and love who has multiple QAA and MH's and who is known as honest and a breeder of Yellows, Chocolates, and Blacks and NOT Silvers ever.

Trevor Toberny · Sep 4, 2015

John, I respect your posts and this gentleman that has a couch dog that wont retrieve anything and he said her parents were the same way and lived with an older couple and they were just house dogs. he had a pedigree on his dog and there was nothing. he mentioned he bought her out of the newspaper. i guess we are lucky enough that he had enough sense to breed to a fc afc instead o another back yard dog. People keep saying things about an untitled mom of pups and yes there are great dogs that are out of non titled bitches but AGAIN this guy bred to a fc afc with not only an untitled bitch with no desire but a full pedigree of non titled dogs and dogs that dont have desire.
i will drop it since i guess im the only one that feels the way i do.

John Robinson · Sep 4, 2015

Trevor Toberny said:
John, I respect your posts and this gentleman that has a couch dog that wont retrieve anything and he said her parents were the same way and lived with an older couple and they were just house dogs. he had a pedigree on his dog and there was nothing. he mentioned he bought her out of the newspaper. i guess we are lucky enough that he had enough sense to breed to a fc afc instead o another back yard dog. People keep saying things about an untitled mom of pups and yes there are great dogs that are out of non titled bitches but AGAIN this guy bred to a fc afc with not only an untitled bitch with no desire but a full pedigree of non titled dogs and dogs that dont have desire.
i will drop it since i guess im the only one that feels the way i do.

I don't think you've taken an unreasonable position, just asked a question. You haven't really condemned the practice just wondered about it. Like many of us have posted, the breeding doesn't bother me, now the next question is how does he plan to market the pups. I really don't think this guy should market them to hunt test or even hunters, they should be considered high quality pets. If he plans on selling to hunt test homes, he should be upfront about the bitch side, that's where the puppy buyers really have to do their homework. Big difference between this breeding and another that is an FC/AFC male bred to an untitled female out of strong field lines.

LJS · Sep 4, 2015

Justin Allen said:
When you have 100k in a male that is still competing come back and tell your sob story. And I don't see anyone breeding to junk pedigrees when I look at litters, pretty well every female has a distinguishable pedigree. I'd like to see all of the critics of Stud owners turn down 1000-2000 stud fees because the bitch isint titled. That's not realistic for the average person

Nothing I said had anything to do with a sob story. And I wouldn't turn down a breeding just because it didn't have a title. This isn't what we are taliking about. We are talking about breeding to a female that has no titles in 3-4 generations. But I'm all for doing whatever you want, I'm just pointing out that it does have reputation consequences.

John Robinson · Sep 4, 2015

LJS said:
Nothing I said had anything to do with a sob story. And I wouldn't turn down a breeding just because it didn't have a title. This isn't what we are taliking about. We are talking about breeding to a female that has no titles in 3-4 generations. But I'm all for doing whatever you want, I'm just pointing out that it does have reputation consequences.

As long as the breeder is upfront and honest about the bitch line when he or she markets the pups, I don't see a problem. I don't see how it would hurt the studs reputation,, I seriously doubt any serious ft or ht puppy buyer would buy a pup just based on the sire, these pups would be sold as pets with some good hunting potential.

EdA · Sep 4, 2015

Trevor Toberny said:
i will drop it since i guess im the only one that feels the way i do.

Don't have a dog in the fight? Don't worry about those who do. Most are fully capable of taking care of themselves and their dogs "reputation".

sick lids · Sep 4, 2015

Any thoughts on what a pup might cost if only fc-afc was bred to fc-afc, the gene pool would be ridiculously small. Breeding high caliber dogs to the pet market can only be a good thing for the breed as a whole when done responsibly.

duk4me · Sep 5, 2015

I don't give a rats ass who breeds what to what. It is up to the BUYER of the puppy to do their due diligence when making a purchase. This improving the breed is a load of crap and usually thrown out there by people who are not even on the fringe of producing top class dogs. If I were fortunate enough to own an FC, and I won't cause I don't enjoy the game, I would breed to whomever I wanted to. It is a joke for someone not even in the game to tell people they are wrong to breed to untitled bitches. I'd bet my lunch money if someone wrote them a 2k check the same people would breed to a freaking wiener dog.

ErinsEdge · Sep 5, 2015

people such as myself can decipher these breeders and it is in turn a poor reflection of the stud owner.When we see a female bred 2 heat cycles in a row to the same FC stud, we remember and ask ourselves why the FC owner would breed to that female.

I totally don't get this whole post. First of all, what's wrong with breeding two times in a row.? Repro vets actually advise it. Maybe it was a good nick and the pups were great.

but hopefully you also realize that these justifications do diminish the ability of people such as myself to buy a decent dog for a decent price too. Someone mentioned 1200 bucks above. Hell, we can't even find that anymore.

You are totally not looking around much

When I see a litter for a reasonable price by a well known FC now, I ask myself what is wrong with those pups. Probably nothing and they were likely bred by someone who knows what he's doing and has common sense.

Now that is really poor reasoning. Kind of like the people that won't buy the last pup in a litter because something must be wrong with him.

But just be aware, who you breed your FC to does have reputation consequences.

It's not like everyone knows who you breed to

duk4me · Sep 5, 2015

It is amazing isn't it Nancy? Where have the knowledgeable people gone on this site. We have neophytes questioning FC breeders and owners and supposed trainers suggesting running dogs for a mile behind a four wheeler holding bumpers. I really fear that some of the advice here is going to injure someone dogs and/or at the least make some newbies make some bad decisions regarding their dogs. Scary to me.

Terry Marshall · Sep 5, 2015

duk4me said:
It is amazing isn't it Nancy? Where have the knowledgeable people gone on this site. We have neophytes questioning FC breeders and owners and supposed trainers suggesting running dogs for a mile behind a four wheeler holding bumpers. I really fear that some of the advice here is going to injure someone dogs and/or at the least make some newbies make some bad decisions regarding their dogs. Scary to me.

Yes Duk4me send me a PM and i will tell you the benefits of running dogs with objects in their mouths, OH and by the way I am not a supposed trainer but support 37 kennels and function on 165 acres of my own land . Who the hell are you, show me your name.

ErinsEdge · Sep 5, 2015

Hey Terry, I think it's cocktail hour in Texas. Might as well have fun!

if you own a FC AFC stud, what do you require?

Krissye00

Rainmaker

truthseeker

Rainmaker

Justin Allen

huntinman

John Robinson

ErinsEdge

Justin Allen

Trevor Toberny

John Robinson

LJS

John Robinson

EdA

sick lids

duk4me

ErinsEdge

duk4me

Terry Marshall

ErinsEdge

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